View Full Version : Is there a correlation between house and techno?
The Overfiend
21-07-2006, 08:48 PM
In the past few years I've noticed a progression or regression of sorts.
Most of the time I noticed people who produced techno once before
do a move to house music.
Sometimes directly full swing like Laidback Luke or Angel Alanis.
What is the reason for this?
Or does it have to do with the relationship of the two genres.
To say the two do not have a coexistence is null.
rhythmtech
21-07-2006, 10:42 PM
there is definitly.. or at least with techno/techhouse.
to me i think its just a need to explore into music further yet at the same time keeping on board what you know. house & techhouse are some what more musical in a traditional sense so will there for, most likely be explored by the more musical producers (alanis definitly being musically gifted). i cant see some nose bleed schranz bootlegger going down the house route but even some of the harder acid bods have done it very succesfully - chris liberator & davethedrummer's HA-LO project on eukatech for example.
Dustin Zahn
21-07-2006, 10:52 PM
they're pretty much the same thing. one just uses more aggressive sounds.
The Overfiend
21-07-2006, 11:08 PM
Great point, what gets me is how certain ones through, draw a line.
laidback luke made a public statement about how techno was too boring for him.
I just don't understand how you go from making a classic like
http://mp3.juno.co.uk/MP3/SF42756-01-01-01.mp3
to
http://mp3.juno.co.uk/MP3/SF213930-01-01-14.mp3
I cringe
eyeswithoutaface
21-07-2006, 11:48 PM
it's all about routine and change, sounds strange, but true. The routine comes in the form of house and techno all being sequenced and produced to a certain degree i.e the 4/4 kick to keep things inline, a hi hat on every 3rd beat etc etc. This brings the routine and familiarity that everyone inside, even sub-conciously, needs to process something correctly. The change comes with the persons own individual "journey" as it were in what they are into, what they are getting into, what they've been into for the past however many years etc etc. Everyone needs a change at some point, otherwise its overkill time. A good example are people like Beyer going down the minimal route, or we'l say "less banging" to save any arguements. They get slated, and i mean seriously slated by some people, for doing something that someone doesnt like. What people forget is that after doing and being known for nigh on ten years for doing that basically one hard, loopy sound, it's going to get mind numbingly boring to the producer and it's by nature that they delve into other areas. But they have an audience that they dont want to totally alienate. Hence the routine section, something familiar whilst changing the overall product
like that example above from Tony, which personally i happen to enjoy the 2nd sample more. Notice it sounds alot better produced than the Pump Panel track too, which is a classic definately, but im guessing the 2nd release came a while after which just shows the natural progression, the natural maturation of the producer and need to change....
so basically, its just natural
Stella Boy
22-07-2006, 12:02 AM
laidback luke made a public statement about how techno was too boring for him.
I just don't understand how you go from making a classic like
http://mp3.juno.co.uk/MP3/SF42756-01-01-01.mp3
to
http://mp3.juno.co.uk/MP3/SF213930-01-01-14.mp3
I cringe
perhaps his taste in music production changed and got bored of doing something which he wasn't into anymore; it happens.
they're pretty much the same thing. one just uses more aggressive sounds.
Some of the best techno ever produced has the most lush sounds you could ever want to hear. Aggressive sounds may be the 1st thing alot of people say about it but it's not exactly true.
eyeswithoutaface
22-07-2006, 12:11 AM
yeah agreed, if talking about hard techno maybe
but stick on "Windchimes" by UR (Perception if my memory holds up)
sheer beauty
or "High Tech Jazz"
swoooooooooon
rhythmtech
22-07-2006, 12:12 AM
Some of the best techno ever produced has the most lush sounds you could ever want to hear. Aggressive sounds may be the 1st thing alot of people say about it but it's not exactly true.
i'd agree with that.. i think techno just uses them in a more aggresive way.
Stella Boy
22-07-2006, 12:44 AM
Some of the best techno ever produced has the most lush sounds you could ever want to hear. Aggressive sounds may be the 1st thing alot of people say about it but it's not exactly true.
i'd agree with that.. i think techno just uses them in a more aggresive way.
Hard techno yes but there's sooo much more to techno than hard beats and aggression. Alot of house and techno coming out at the moment is very similar, to he point of house & techno dj's merging the 2. Not that this hasn't been done before but it's easier for alot of dj's who like both genres to merge the 2 together without much risk of their set sounding disjointed or slightly confused.
IMO - it would be very easy to grab some of the modern prog stuff along with some of the recent mnml techno & throw in some bingo bango bongo sims-esq stuff and the set would flow and go well in alot of house/techno clubs; but obviously not the hard techno clubs :lol:
holotropik
22-07-2006, 12:55 AM
When you are young you just want to bang away
when you get a bit older you was to slide...
There is also the element of survival in the industry
that can sway some into a more house direction.
Lately round these parts there has been a trend
into the more house/thump side of things with more
venues and peeps wanting this sound. You kinda get
left out if you cant play this side of the music.
I have always foound that when I want to just chill
with my lady, enjoy a spliff and the lovin
then something tending on the house side is perfect.
Just leave the cheesy vocals out of it....
The Overfiend
22-07-2006, 01:02 AM
Depending on how the vocal is done.
If its that back to church in alabama stuff then no
but if its like esthero and ian pooleys then go for it
holotropik
22-07-2006, 01:04 AM
yep, true
there are some great vocs
We dont like the overdone pop sorta thing.
Stella Boy
22-07-2006, 01:21 AM
you can effectively use any vocal from anywhere in the world, from any walk of life. How you use those sample says how good you are as a dj/producer.
Dustin Zahn
22-07-2006, 01:29 AM
I should add to what i meant before...normally I mean the predictable kind of techno that you would find on places like BOA. Detroit Techno in my mind is just as much as house music as it is techno.
Little_Fella!
22-07-2006, 01:33 AM
Alot of people may have started with House from the Eighties onwards and some, like myself, would go for the darker more moody side, say like 'Lets Get Brutal' by Nitro Delux...
Joey Beltram once said that he didn't think that he was making Techno when he created Energy Flash, he just thought he was making dark House music...
This is where the blending of the two genres comes from I think.
:question:
Little_Fella!
22-07-2006, 01:38 AM
So therefore maybe producers who headed for what could be categorised as pure or acid techno, as has been said, are heading away naturally from something they have been producing for some time...
The creative spark leaning back towards where they came from.... :question:
Little_Fella!
22-07-2006, 01:47 AM
There is more money in House of course, which is probably part of a producers decision making process also...
Timo Mass did this... He created the likes of 'Ubik' and 'Der Schieber', which I loved, and then he shot off into commercial House.. This for me was a great shame :(
The Overfiend
22-07-2006, 03:03 AM
Some have done it excrutiatingly right
Like Cajmere aka Green Velvet
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UcsqoPiSF5Q
The Overfiend
22-07-2006, 03:03 AM
I do drive by Shake & Pops.
holotropik
22-07-2006, 03:19 AM
hehehe...
...goes and trys some new dance moves...shhh! ;)
The Overfiend
22-07-2006, 03:34 AM
Ian Pooley is also on this list for being awesome at both.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vhfWWX_vLqM
module
22-07-2006, 03:50 AM
my fave clubs always played both, and the really good ones ? well, ya couldnt spot the join ;)
Spire
22-07-2006, 06:12 AM
house belongs in gay clubs.
house belongs in gay clubs.
and you are regular visitor there
so you know?
loopdon
22-07-2006, 04:19 PM
nothing wrong with having a house area. what's this gay bullshit?
The Overfiend
23-07-2006, 01:46 AM
Most house producers I know get a ton of girls
Dj Sneak
Cajmere
Armand Van Helden
Junior Sanchez
These guys have no problems with baggin em up...
Jesus.. what an amazing thread..
House and techno a correlation?
Thats just daft... of course there is... go and read 'Last night a DJ saved my life'
Armand van helden 'Boogie Monster' more techno than a lot of techno i heard...
Takes it back to what Juan Atkins said... (i could be mis-quoting here) 'Techno is any sound in a tune your never heard before'
Techno defies catagorisation... house doesnt appear to exhibit the same qaulities until your start listening to people like Dan Curtain... his early stricly rhtytm stuff was rocking and its always been the way that NY based house had a tinge of electronica attached to it...
As long as its funky and electronic and makes yo' ass move, what does it matter. i love good quality music, from all genres.. to diferentiate is a WASTE OF TIME.
Good music.. is just good music.
The Overfiend
23-07-2006, 02:22 AM
I'm not saying I didn't know if there was a connection.
I'm saying why do some producers shift focus to, and starting discussion.
The Overfiend
23-07-2006, 06:54 AM
To mock peoples interest in discussion is more so daft.
In my opinion.
A lot of people love House and Techno
Concurrently.
holotropik
23-07-2006, 07:16 AM
More girls go out to listen to house...than techno, simple.
I'm not saying I didn't know if there was a connection.
I'm saying why do some producers shift focus to, and starting discussion.
o.k. antonio, fair play. The way i see it is that there IS no difference. It isnt even a question for me. Maybe my reaction there was a little more incredulous thn you would have liked...
but i still gave my opinion, and if you read it u'd see i was agreeing with you...(armand van helden etc)
The two genres are so vastly intertwined... also i didnt see it was your thread, had i done so i would have treated it differently. its just not a question i would expect off you, kinda threw me. no disrespect meant.
and clearly i wasnt belittling the discussion otherwise i wouldnt have joined in now would I.
Never mind .. more excuses for you to blank me on msn ... not that you needed one... :lol:
cya.
eyeswithoutaface
23-07-2006, 10:50 AM
well in all fairness, the thread title and the thread content are confusing. The title ask's if there is a correlation between house and techno, whilst the content isnt the same, it's simply Tony stating his annoyance in some of his fave producers going in another direction
i wouldnt of thought anyone using the board would seriously need the relationship between house and techno explaining to them really
The Overfiend
23-07-2006, 05:50 PM
Kind of sort of sort of kind of.
It was more of a why do you think this occurs kind of thing.
I have nothing against damn good house.
It's just that certain aspects of it are not so good.
For example my opinion is that the Luke material he does of late, is uber sell out ish,
Meanwhile Kenny Larkin or Saunderson when they do house it's damn good and has a great amount of artisitic integrity to it.
eyeswithoutaface
23-07-2006, 07:00 PM
yeah have to agree there
i think to sum it up it's probably a combination of musical maturity, age, years spent in the business, possible lack of cash etc etc
human nature i guess? curiousity to try new things, your personal situation at the time etc
i know what you mean though. There is some awful, woeful house music out there as well as the good stuff
give me MAW anyday
dirty_bass
24-07-2006, 01:22 AM
I think any producer who`s been at it for a while needs and will want to spread out to try other things at some point. I`d say it`s natural and inevitable.
To make just techno forever, or just house forever etc, is a horrible thought.
Plus branching out allows you to take techniques and ideas from each genre and cross them over to each other.
So that`s why I guess some producers do it, although money probably has something to do with it as well.
If you are approaching whatever music you do creatively and honestly, I don`t think it matters a damn what you do.
Jay Pace
24-07-2006, 01:18 PM
Techno has a different attitude to house. It has a rawness and an edge to it that house smoothes over.
I'd also say that techno generally has more of a focus upon rhythmn than melody or hook, whereas in house rhythmn tends to be the backing rather than centre stage.
Essentially though house and techno are two sides of the same coin. Same instruments, same samples, same machines, same heritage, same clubs, similar crowds...
I think techno is more akin to abstract or impressionist art.
The motivators are different, as is the appeal.
I really like the fact that joey beltram wasn't trying to make techno. Why the hell should you make music to fit within a certain genre? Much more intersting to make music and for it to be intepreted by djs or crowds...
I doubt Mr Oizo ever foresaw his tracks being used by everyone to different ends. Levis ads? Trance? Breaks? Techno?
The Overfiend
24-07-2006, 05:12 PM
Some have done it excrutiatingly right
Like Cajmere aka Green Velvet
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UcsqoPiSF5Q
could not something like this be considered both?
wouldnt the line be very dim at this point?
same for the uc brand of chitown jack for years on end.
oldbugger
24-07-2006, 07:34 PM
Some have done it excrutiatingly right
Like Cajmere aka Green Velvet
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UcsqoPiSF5Q
could not something like this be considered both?
wouldnt the line be very dim at this point?
same for the uc brand of chitown jack for years on end.
not either in my opinion. just a load of shite pop bollocks
most of the stuff i love is on the very fine line between the two. is there even a line ? does anyone care? why do we need to define everything?
i had people coming up saying to me the other night "i thought u were doing a house set" :lol:
i was.
Techno has a different attitude to house. It has a rawness and an edge to it that house smoothes over.
I'd also say that techno generally has more of a focus upon rhythmn than melody or hook, whereas in house rhythmn tends to be the backing rather than centre stage
theres so much quality dirty as f*ck house out there that makes thats so untrue. not slagging off the comment or anything though.
i wish more of the techno crowd would check out the good house out there. i bet there would be some supprises
eyeswithoutaface
24-07-2006, 07:45 PM
yeah house has a bad image of complete cheesy smoothness, when more often than not it couldnt be any further from the truth. Some of the best house music ive heard has been the rawest most loosely produced music ive heard, yet it seriously gets under the skin and stays there.
id put my last tenner on the line and state that practically everyone will have danced to at least 5 house records in their time whilst out in a club and thought it was techno
davethedrummer
24-07-2006, 11:02 PM
i don't think techno is necessarily harder than house
or more " raw " or more " aggresive "
to me they are pretty much one in the same on many levels.
but techno is largely more abstract
house is musically more traditional.
i reckon
The Overfiend
25-07-2006, 12:51 AM
i don't think techno is necessarily harder than house
or more " raw " or more " aggresive "
to me they are pretty much one in the same on many levels.
but techno is largely more abstract
house is musically more traditional.
i reckon
Great point
Shake and pop to me is not pop ish
That's as dirty girtty underground chi town house party as it gets.
oldbugger
25-07-2006, 08:20 AM
i don't think techno is necessarily harder than house
or more " raw " or more " aggresive "
to me they are pretty much one in the same on many levels.
but techno is largely more abstract
house is musically more traditional.
i reckon
Great point
Shake and pop to me is not pop ish
That's as dirty girtty underground chi town house party as it gets.
you really should check out some propper filth then.
thats squeaky clean
heres some real filthy house
http://mp3.juno.co.uk/MP3/SF1208347-02-01-01.mp3
http://mp3.juno.co.uk/MP3/SF1208347-02-01-02.mp3
http://mp3.juno.co.uk/MP3/SF1208336-02-01-02.mp3
http://mp3.juno.co.uk/MP3/SF1215139-02-01-09.mp3
oldbugger
25-07-2006, 08:25 AM
That's as dirty girtty underground chi town house party as it gets
***makes a mental note to never go to a chi town house party
Jay Pace
25-07-2006, 01:02 PM
theres so much quality dirty as f*ck house out there that makes thats so untrue. not slagging off the comment or anything though.
i wish more of the techno crowd would check out the good house out there. i bet there would be some supprises
True dat.
I get houseFM where I live. Its mint.
There's a big fat overlap between the two genres. Sadly I don't have time to trawl through all the new house releases in addition to the new techno. Although I pick up a bit of house through digging through techno djs tracklists, and get put on to artists labels and that way.
Some GREAT points there.
House is techno/techno is house. Each is a genre. No-one really knows which is which.
Speaking of...
http://www.blackoutaudio.co.uk/portal/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&t=52962
i know its a shameless plug... but err.. it IS to mke a point. The thing i did for them is called house leaders, except i didnt particularly think it was much to do with house TBH, but the people who commisioned me thought otherwise. So their definition of house is different to mine.
This is a typical example of the trusim that music is both contextual and subjective. House is no different.
davethedrummer
25-07-2006, 05:05 PM
i don't think techno is necessarily harder than house
or more " raw " or more " aggresive "
to me they are pretty much one in the same on many levels.
but techno is largely more abstract
house is musically more traditional.
i reckon
Great point
Shake and pop to me is not pop ish
That's as dirty girtty underground chi town house party as it gets.
you really should check out some propper filth then.
thats squeaky clean
heres some real filthy house
http://mp3.juno.co.uk/MP3/SF1208347-02-01-01.mp3
http://mp3.juno.co.uk/MP3/SF1208347-02-01-02.mp3
http://mp3.juno.co.uk/MP3/SF1208336-02-01-02.mp3
http://mp3.juno.co.uk/MP3/SF1215139-02-01-09.mp3
lol
thats funny man
because you could really argue that a couple of those tracks in there are techno , i mean they obviously have house elements but they have real techno elements too.
the one with the bassline and the girl talkng is a beauty though innit?
really sexy housey stuff
techno just isn't sexy like that i don't think
it's more perverted.
and the girls aren't as pretty
like in this clip :
http://www.davethedrummer.net/images/SwedenvGB11.pps
stjohn
25-07-2006, 05:23 PM
thats gas!! techno can be sexy tho....
have you not heard the schranz remix of French Kiss??
oldbugger
25-07-2006, 07:33 PM
i don't think techno is necessarily harder than house
or more " raw " or more " aggresive "
to me they are pretty much one in the same on many levels.
but techno is largely more abstract
house is musically more traditional.
i reckon
Great point
Shake and pop to me is not pop ish
That's as dirty girtty underground chi town house party as it gets.
you really should check out some propper filth then.
thats squeaky clean
heres some real filthy house
http://mp3.juno.co.uk/MP3/SF1208347-02-01-01.mp3
http://mp3.juno.co.uk/MP3/SF1208347-02-01-02.mp3
http://mp3.juno.co.uk/MP3/SF1208336-02-01-02.mp3
http://mp3.juno.co.uk/MP3/SF1215139-02-01-09.mp3
lol
thats funny man
because you could really argue that a couple of those tracks in there are techno , i mean they obviously have house elements but they have real techno elements too.
the one with the bassline and the girl talkng is a beauty though innit?
really sexy housey stuff
techno just isn't sexy like that i don't think
it's more perverted.
and the girls aren't as pretty
like in this clip :
http://www.davethedrummer.net/images/SwedenvGB11.pps
that track your on about with the bassline is 'what is this sound' by peace division.
i would deffinatly call it house. but my point really is
who cares?
its just a great track :cheese: and you will never find stuff like that in a techno section.
so when you gonna do a fithy house set henry? ;)
davethedrummer
25-07-2006, 09:44 PM
thats gas!! techno can be sexy tho....
have you not heard the schranz remix of French Kiss??
thats about as sexy sounding, as a piece of sandpaper down your pants :shock:
rhythmtech
25-07-2006, 09:53 PM
thats gas!! techno can be sexy tho....
have you not heard the schranz remix of French Kiss??
thats about as sexy sounding, as a piece of sandpaper down your pants :shock:
:eyes: :eyes: shexxxxxy
oldbugger
25-07-2006, 10:09 PM
thats gas!! techno can be sexy tho....
have you not heard the schranz remix of French Kiss??
do you honestly think thats sexy music?
your perverted mate :lol:
eyeswithoutaface
25-07-2006, 11:12 PM
schranz remix. French Kiss
Why? Honestly, as god is my witness, WHY? What on earth could some god awful schranz remix of such a seminal tune possibly bring us in this day and age? Have people not heard that Sandy Warez remix of Bird's On E?
schranz and classic tracks do not go together. At all. Ever. Period (full stop)
oldbugger
25-07-2006, 11:36 PM
schranz remix. French Kiss
Why? Honestly, as god is my witness, WHY? What on earth could some god awful schranz remix of such a seminal tune possibly bring us in this day and age? Have people not heard that Sandy Warez remix of Bird's On E?
schranz and classic tracks do not go together. At all. Ever. Period (full stop)
i was gonn akick off about this too but i couldn't be arsed coz i knew you would :lol:
i really want to hear this...anyone got a link.
it sounds hillarious. :cheese:
eyeswithoutaface
25-07-2006, 11:40 PM
i bet the irony is that the person who did the remix is a few years younger than the original French Kiss!
what with the average schranz producers age being roughly 9 - 10 years old ;)
oldbugger
25-07-2006, 11:54 PM
i bet the irony is that the person who did the remix is a few years younger than the original French Kiss!
what with the average schranz producers age being roughly 9 - 10 years old ;)
now now :nono:
:lol:
The Overfiend
26-07-2006, 08:01 AM
i bet the irony is that the person who did the remix is a few years younger than the original French Kiss!
what with the average schranz producers age being roughly 9 - 10 years old ;)
lmao
best french kiss remix ever was aural exciter part two
i bet the irony is that the person who did the remix is a few years younger than the original French Kiss!
what with the average schranz producers age being roughly 9 - 10 years old ;)
That must be an overstatement! :cheese:
eyeswithoutaface
26-07-2006, 07:52 PM
i think the word you mean is "understatement"
Oh well, music is music.
It's all great to me.
oldbugger
26-07-2006, 09:29 PM
Oh well, music is music.
It's all great to me.
innit mate...and house n techno especially :cheese:
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