Help getting these kick sounds

[Loop]

Im up against a wall getting a decent deep kick sound. These are some examples of the thing im after.
http://www.truelove.co.uk/sound/hydraulix/previews/hydraulix012_1.mp3
and this one from smear, the original mix
http://www.boomkat.com/item.cfm?id=119771

Any one?

Ta.

[The_Laughing_Man]

hmm 2 different kicks there.

The 1st sounds like a 808 style detuned klick without too much drive so it`s low and boomy, maybe doubled with something a little more solid and then compressed.

the 2nd sounds like a downtuned 909, nice compression, maybe paired again with something with more click for the nose


It`s hard to be specific, but I`ve just spent a few minutes trying to get something similar in terms of power and depth, and below is a quick visual tutorial on what I did.

Using Drumular to generate the kick (any sine bassed kick gen will do), and sonalksis stereo comp for compression.


Firstly, have a look at the kick settings on drumular.
I took a preset and adjusted it.
Downtuned the bass frequency, uptuned the "click" freq, adjusted the sweep on the main sine a bit for more bite.

http://www.iterativemusic.com/db/Drumular-Kick-Settings.jpg

Copy the settings and have a play with the settings, you`ll get the idea
Next I applied EQ.
Kicks are so important in Techno I think additive EQ is allowed to give extra beef.

http://www.iterativemusic.com/db/Kick-EQ-Settings.jpg

So I boosted the low shelf at 80hz by 8db!!
Then I gave the mid bass a boost at 120hz by 4 db
Pushed the highs at 4200 to give the nose more bite, and ghave it some Air at 12k

Next is the compression.
http://www.iterativemusic.com/db/Kick-Compression-Settings.jpg

As you can see I squeezed the bitch quite hard. -6db GR
hard ratio and knee

Finally a further touch of EQ post compression to push things even harder and deeper.

http://www.iterativemusic.com/db/Kick-Post-Compression-EQSettings.jpg

Another low shelf boost to get it all low beefy, Another little boost around 110 just to get that mid bass Stomach hit
A mid range boost at 1600 of 5db to get a good bit of chest hit
And a little more air for the click/nose.

So there you go, not a hard and fast rule, but a way to get a solid as hell low slung kick.
I would maybe try those settings and then pull down the sine frequency of the drumular a touch to taste.

[Loop]

Thanks so much man, really useful. I think my main problem is lack of decent synthesis, im on an old mac and use samples most of the time, could i use operator?

[The_Laughing_Man]

I have never used operator, but it`s possible.
There are freeware sine generators about, not sure if they are mac though.

[stjohn]

good stuff Laughing Man. good to see your workflow.
also Loop, echoing ChrisMcCormack:

a kick sounds big only in context with the rest of the mix.

[BloodStar]

well made tutorial, Steve.

i never think about so big boosts on the eq and then wild compression.... deffinitely gonna give it a try,. pretty curious about what happens after tweeking the Attack knob on the Sonalksis compressor ;-)

if you could do similar little tutorial on the bass sound, would be muchos appreciated.

[The_Laughing_Man]

Well if you pull back the attack too much you kill the bite of the kick.
I use a very short attack if I am compressing bass.

[loopdon]

Thanks, Laughing Man.

I really wish we had more of those illustrated tuts here.

Really glad you took the time.

PS: Is your Production workshop pt.2 already there?

[The_Laughing_Man]

well, I kinda scrapped the production tutorial.

However I am doing a video interview on How I make a tune for Synapse Audio, which will contain tons of advice as I will be going through start to finish on making a track.

probably some dub techno, as I always get asked about working big bass into techno.

I`ll post it here when it`s online. 2 weeks maybe?

if it proves popular I might do another one on another form of techno

[loopdon]

It will surely be popular, mate.
Looking forward!

[Jay Pace]

is drumular much better than dumatik?

I use drumatik loads.

[The_Laughing_Man]

Drumatic is good, but is a bit specific, being very 808-ish
Drumular is more versatile in the way it sounds, and also much better to edit than those damn stupid envelope points in drumatic, although I do like drumatic.

[curly]

just found this for the mac, not sure if it's any good, just DLing now.

KickMaker

http://static.kvraudio.com/i/s/kickmaker.jpg

KickMaker is a drum synth specifically designed to generate bass and kick drum sounds.
Features:
Four oscillator synthesis, with each oscillator being independently tuned in the range of 20Hz - 125Hz.
ADSR envelopes provided for each oscillator (with visual feedback), as well as a global ADSR curve.
Fine-tuning of oscillators allow for adjustment of frequencies within 0.1Hz.
Mixer for oscillators provides easy way of controlling the presence of each wave.
Per-oscillator white-noise generator.
Per-oscillator phase control.
"Frequency Expander" effect available for each oscillator. This effect will start the oscillator at a higher frequency and drop the frequency to the originally tuned value. The end result creates a realistic "smack" noise that can be used to generate a wide range of kicks.
Compression effect with variable attack, release, threshold, and ratio parameters.
Convenient preset manager allows for one-click saving and deletion of presets, as well as scrolling through preset banks.
Quick on-screen help reference.

http://www.teragon.org/products/KickMaker.html

[dj boss]

well, I kinda scrapped the production tutorial.

However I am doing a video interview on How I make a tune for Synapse Audio, which will contain tons of advice as I will be going through start to finish on making a track.

probably some dub techno, as I always get asked about working big bass into techno.

I`ll post it here when it`s online. 2 weeks maybe?

if it proves popular I might do another one on another form of techno



Any sign of this, sounds interesting!