into the red with software mixers.

when mixing (i use FL studio), i'm not sure whether to take my levels past unity or should i keep everything below unity when using a software mixer?

Recently i have been taking my drum track and pushing it a few db's past unity (+3db) and reducing my mixers output so it's not clipping. From there i mix in all the other tracks accordingly.
I read an article recently that the master output should be left at unity and i should mix the entire track without adjusting the master fader. The article has left me a little confused as to what approach to mixing techno i should take.

Q. Is it worth taking the drum track a few db's past unity on a software mixer? It looks healthier on my spectral analyser by the way.

Any advice would be much appreciated. :)

also on the FL Studio mixer, each track shows the mixer level to go to +3db. Because i use a 24bit sound card, does that mean i can take my levels a few db's past unity because i have extra headroom with my 24bit card?

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Originally Posted by Radic

also on the FL Studio mixer, each track shows the mixer level to go to +3db. Because i use a 24bit sound card, does that mean i can take my levels a few db's past unity because i have extra headroom with my 24bit card?

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you should stay below 0db when recording digitally, whatever the bit rate. otherwise digital clipping occurs which is not very helpful for sound quality!!

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Originally Posted by theledge

you should stay below 0db when recording digitally, whatever the bit rate. otherwise digital clipping occurs which is not very helpful for sound quality!!

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yep i understand that at the recording stage but what about at the mixing stage? When i take the signal up past unity i don't hear any clipping.

When you mixdown or record it will become apparent.

You can run signals red off your software mixer, and they might sound ok - but when you record them back they will sound shit.

Make sure your master fader is unclipped on your software mixer. You can clip an analog mixer happily, but do it on a digital signal and it sounds horrible.

In software, red = bad.

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Originally Posted by Jay Pace

When you mixdown or record it will become apparent.

You can run signals red off your software mixer, and they might sound ok - but when you record them back they will sound shit.

Make sure your master fader is unclipped on your software mixer. You can clip an analog mixer happily, but do it on a digital signal and it sounds horrible.

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yeah i never let the master fader clip over unity but some of the other channels ive had bouncin a few db's over unity and i never noticed any harm at all. What's happenin to the signal if u breach unity with software? Is there some kind of brickwall that kicks in? I've pushed me levels up at around 7db + and still can't hear no clipping distortion. And yeah like i said b4 i noticed it looks a lot better on the spectral analyser and the track has more punch without me having to hit the overall track harder with a compressor/limiter.

Also i noticed if track one is bouncin at around +3db and i route that to track 2 and adjust the fader to show unity, there's more punch on the master fader than if i just had track 1 bouncin at unity and routed track 1 straight to the master fader.

If you push a signal past 0 with a digital mixer you clip the signal. If you look at the result of this you can see that the top of the waveform has been squared off - information has been lost and it usually sounds horrible. But if used properly it is just a type of distortion.

You won't notice the problems of software clipping until you record it back digitally. Its when you need to capture the sound that you notice that you can't record all the extra volume you are throwing at it.

A small amount of digital clipping causes a small amount of information to be lost. It quickly becomes a horrible problem though. There's nothing to be gained by pushing it 1 or 2db, if you're desperate for it to be louder then you should do it properly and use a proper maximizer, limiter, compressor, or whatever.

cool no probs thanks for the info. :)

Ok to me the answer is simple, you say your master output is fine, so what you do with anything else is fair game..

There is no right answer but there is a correct question to ask yourself.......does it sound good/right to you?
If yes then who cares how it was done.

hope this helps

Keep the lwo sounds around -1 / 0 dB, and the higher sounds around -3dB.
And keep your master signal into the green. And that article that comments about not ajusting the masterlevel, I wouldn't trust on that.

FL studio is a weird one like that. In anything else if it's into the red on any channel it's immediately audible. In FL Studio you can push it WAAAAAY into the red on any of the inserts but as long as the master is below 0db it's fine. My advice is to try and keep it below 0dbs anyway. That way you get into the habbit of not doing it on other sequencers. FL studio uses a 32 bit audio engine, so you're not likely to be able to make out the noise difference between a hot and not so hot signal once it's limited on the master channel.

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Originally Posted by danielmarshall

FL studio uses a 32 bit audio engine, so you're not likely to be able to make out the noise difference between a hot and not so hot signal once it's limited on the master channel.

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32 bit audio engine?

what effects does this have on sound compared to a 24bit engine.

and what progs use 24bit?

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Originally Posted by danielmarshall

FL studio is a weird one like that. In anything else if it's into the red on any channel it's immediately audible. In FL Studio you can push it WAAAAAY into the red on any of the inserts but as long as the master is below 0db it's fine. .

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Sweet dude that's the answer i was lookin for.