How to take hard techno forward

The biggest and most annoying problem I find for hard techno (and it ties in with Sash's last post) is the programming of nights by promoters, and the amount of DJs who still don't believe in variety.

Now, if you start your set basically the same way you're going to finish it too, you are just going the bore everyone and make people see hard techno in a very bad light. A lot of people ridicule hard techno for being all boom boom, and dismiss the whole lot... and that sickens me, particularly when I know they are judging most of their opinions on DJs they've seen that don't have the ability to be 'diverse', or who play just one narrow style of hard techno for the whole set.

If you can bounce around from style to style, by the time you get into fearsome hard techno territory it's going to sound *much* better. It stands to reason. A night of drilling techno for four or five hours or m ore, does so much damage to this music in the long run. More people should cop onto this fact.

Turntables with broken pitch controllers causing all sorts of random speed ups and slow downs.
Beer spilled into a favorite machine that turns it into an angry drunk - sparks = fists of fury
needles made of styrofoam
Hell..throw the tempo control to the crowd. Interesting if mob mentality takes over.
I realise none of this is on topic, but isn't that the point of the thread?

The best crowd reaction I have seen from hard techno lately was Jeff Mills absolutely destroying the main arena at Sonar.
With just a 909. There were probably around 10,000 people there, and Mills was playing very, very hard - and yet he managed to connect with the room and hold everyone.

Get back to basics I reckon.
People feel obliged to be clever with all the tools they have and want to use all the options available.
Using the latest technology to full effect does not make a track grab hold of the floor.

Stuffing tracks with polyrhytmic edits, morphing dynamics and other crazy things might be satisfying from a production point of view, but I have yet to see anyone top Mills' attacking a room with a piece of hardware made two decades ago.

I used to love hard techno for its ability to communicate energy and urgency in a clear & distinct way. Then it seemed to get overly complicated, or just a big fat distorted mess.
Both approaches seemed to alienate more people than it attracted.

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Originally Posted by Sunil

The biggest and most annoying problem I find for hard techno (and it ties in with Sash's last post) is the programming of nights by promoters, and the amount of DJs who still don't believe in variety.

Now, if you start your set basically the same way you're going to finish it too, you are just going the bore everyone and make people see hard techno in a very bad light. A lot of people ridicule hard techno for being all boom boom, and dismiss the whole lot... and that sickens me, particularly when I know they are judging most of their opinions on DJs they've seen that don't have the ability to be 'diverse', or who play just one narrow style of hard techno for the whole set.

If you can bounce around from style to style, by the time you get into fearsome hard techno territory it's going to sound *much* better. It stands to reason. A night of drilling techno for four or five hours or m ore, does so much damage to this music in the long run. More people should cop onto this fact.

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I couldnt agree more with that! That is the one thing that can totally ruin a night aswell as giving you a bad opinion on hard techno. Its certainly all about progression.

Hard techno should stop being so hard.

What you should do is create the genre "Soft techno" (techno for the tea & biscuits generation) which is made up of no kick drum & no bass - its basically just a pallet of light & airy rhythms.

On entry to the "soft techno" club you recieve a yoga mat and a complimentary cup of tea (in a plastic cup of course) and "nice" biscuit. The chill-out room consists of live pan pipe players for those that require something a little more worldly.

It's a sure winner.

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Originally Posted by Col

Hard techno should stop being so hard.

What you should do is create the genre "Soft techno" (techno for the tea & biscuits generation) which is made up of no kick drum & no bass - its basically just a pallet of light & airy rhythms.

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isn't that what minimal is???

:lol:

Even looking at calling it hard techno I think isn`t looking forward.
A kick drum is heavy on a good soundsystem no matter what, and I`ve heard non "hard techno" bang the hell out of people more than some "hard techno"

Techno should be a fluid music, that changes and incorporates new sounds and ideas consantly, but with the information overload of modern life, people tend to focus down into their own personal niche. Which is why you get DJ`s playing what amounts to the same track for 2 hours, and guys releasing pretty much the same tracks over and over again.

If you are a "hard techno" producer, maybe you should stick your head up out of the nest and have a look about, before you find out the rest of the world has long moved on, same for any producer really. If you just stick to one little sub genre, then sooner or later, like any artist repeating themes in any art form, you will find yourself constantly watering down your creative intensity, and stand still in the river, while others flow along with it.

Maybe hard techno is dead?, maybe it`s said all it can say, and a new form is replacing it, and some of us just can`t let go.

I don`t know, but personally I`m gonna try to keep doing different things and keep on experimenting, and will definitely not sign up to one particular sub genre, developing the elitist atittude of "this is the best form of x".

i think these discussions lead to nothing
if someone wants to make good music - hes gonna make it
"not copying" is hardly any advice
anyone with half his brain wouldnt copy his fav artists and would go for something original
and if ure retarded and u do it - someone saying it to u doesnt really lead to some big realisation, does it? i mean, u being retarded and all...

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Originally Posted by Ryuuku

and if ure retarded and u do it - someone saying it to u doesnt really lead to some big realisation, does it? i mean, u being retarded and all...

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:lol:

"It's been staring me in the ****ing face... I'm patently a spastic..."

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Originally Posted by Dustin Zahn

To blame the distributors for all problems is ridiculous. They need the artists as much as the artists need them. If your distributor doesn't have faith in you then you probably shouldn't be with them, period. Trust me...coming from a bigger family of all entreprenuers, it's much harder to sell something you don't believe in.

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very true, never had any problems with our distributor dictating the sound. but we don't have a p&d deal so if the release bombs we lose the cash.

It's all about hiring young children to create your music for you. Sub-contracting out the work for the fresh ideas. Nothing sounds more "fresh" to ones ears than something created by someone not knowing what they are doing.

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Originally Posted by thetonewrecka

It's all about hiring young children to create your music for you. Sub-contracting out the work for the fresh ideas. Nothing sounds more "fresh" to ones ears than something created by someone not knowing what they are doing.

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There is a reason why Paul Birken is a genius.

IMO techno has lost a lot of its charm - that for me was the raw, quirky individual sound, where anything goes to certain extent.#
A lot of it has become forumulaic, with a 'paint by numbers' kind of approach. I belive the guilt lies equally between artists and producers:

Distros are reluctant to take a chance on something new because they are stuggling to make ends meet, compaies getting liquidated left right and centre and it is a financial risk for them to try something new, especially in todays digital culture.
Artists, some of whom are established and renowned sit on their laurels, content to reproduce their sound which made them, but reluctant to think outside the box and use their influence to redirect the music.

For unsigned artsits, it has got to be tricky to push a new soudn without pandering to some kind of normality - how can your music be heard if you are unsigned - how can you be signed when your music is not heard?

My thoughts anyway :)

Abba said it best "Take a chance on me"

@Error404 - your comment about unsigned artists having trouble getting signed. I would say that 90% of the "demos" that come to my label are just mp3 links in a email that tell me nothing about the artist and what they are trying to express. Now it is different if I send a request to someone and say "hey, send me some links to preview" because I'm expecting them then (usually after having many email conversations with the person I might be interested in). My point is that if more "new" producers took time to put together a small package with their tracks on a cd, a note about why they are sending the music to me to listen to, or possibly release and even their favorite cookie receipe, it would show me that they are serious about their music and trying to make a personal connection with someone to help broadcast that sound to others. There is nothing that will make me throw out an email faster than a "bulk" send type demo where I feel that the person sending it doesn't care where it comes out, or who puts it out.

My answer to taking things forward lies in artists reconnecting with labels and labels with the artists they work with and building the trust factor and understanding between. I know some of you are writing children's bedtime songs, or gameshow theme songs(but we'd never know it)...when will I get to hear them to put out as an inside cut alongside a blistering sonic mayhem workout?

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Originally Posted by thetonewrecka

Abba said it best "Take a chance on me"

@Error404 - your comment about unsigned artists having trouble getting signed. I would say that 90% of the "demos" that come to my label are just mp3 links in a email that tell me nothing about the artist and what they are trying to express. Now it is different if I send a request to someone and say "hey, send me some links to preview" because I'm expecting them then (usually after having many email conversations with the person I might be interested in). My point is that if more "new" producers took time to put together a small package with their tracks on a cd, a note about why they are sending the music to me to listen to, or possibly release and even their favorite cookie receipe, it would show me that they are serious about their music and trying to make a personal connection with someone to help broadcast that sound to others. There is nothing that will make me throw out an email faster than a "bulk" send type demo where I feel that the person sending it doesn't care where it comes out, or who puts it out.

My answer to taking things forward lies in artists reconnecting with labels and labels with the artists they work with and building the trust factor and understanding between. I know some of you are writing children's bedtime songs, or gameshow theme songs(but we'd never know it)...when will I get to hear them to put out as an inside cut alongside a blistering sonic mayhem workout?

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Thats really good advice.

Thanks man

Totally understand what you are saying :)

you missed the point of what i was trying to say - that being distributors will only continue to press new music if it sells. They know what sells and what doesn't, they are very cautious about picking up anything new incase it doesn't sell.
So my point was not that distributors / labels etc don't listen to new stuff, its that they are too wary of backing something unknown (for good reason). So essentially its a bit of a catch 22, dambed if you do, dambed if you don't. :cry:

*spins "wheel of blame" gamepiece

Oh...I have to take this phone call. I'll check back in when this thing stops spinning.

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Originally Posted by ERROR404

distributors will only continue to press new music if it sells. They know what sells and what doesn't, they are very cautious about picking up anything new incase it doesn't sell.

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this is generally why they go under..... when their whole catalogue bores you shitless...

The future of hard techno is Peanut Butter Jelly Time
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=areyUfCNFxY