Techno Production (BEGINNING)

If u r careful enougth 2 read all the posts U will c that there was some care put into explaining why u need this or that... There ain't just 1 truth, what works 4 u doesn't mean it works 4 other people.. with that assumption most people will answer acording 2 they're experiences...

If u can do with a minimal setup then great ... I'm sure most people would love that but truth of the mater is the more u produce and know the more u understand why u need something better ... example now I know why I would love 2 b able 2 buy a urei compressor! ;)
This doen't mean u r wrong.. it works 4 u.. But still I think with time and more experience U'll probably agree with most posts...

M8 I don't mean 2 b paternising or anything .. I started producing with just one workstation, I used 2 think the sound was ok, and some tracks have mede it fresh 'till today.. but I get :oops: everytime I hear them 'cause now I can hear so many wrong things in it.. and I'm not refering 2 track structure!

Z

Thats so true z :lol: After time you will come to realise that using a minimal setup will be limiting to the impact your tracks will have production wise. Espiecially when you get into full on compression, and maximizing techniquies. Even a decent EQ can make all the difference from a flat, lifeless track, to a perfectly balanced track, with all fequancies seperated from each other, so the minutest little details come through in the mix.

One thing you have said is that you dont have, or need, monitors. The longer you produce, the more you will realise you will need good monitors.

I'd even go as far as saying you don't need good monitors. I use normal computer speakers, then I monitor with monitor head phones and make changes from there. You get used to knowing how it will turn out anyway, even if you can't hear it all through crap computer speakers. You know you have some deep bass when you bring it down to 100 hz etc... So really, come on guys, it's all in your ears. Or between your ears. You get more creative and learn more with a financial limit. I've already had tracks of mine mixed into sets. There is a club in Calgary AB. Canada called "Machine" that plays my stuff from time to time. Not bragging just making a point.

I really dont understand your logic :?: This post was about what equipment should he get for a starting setup. And the first thing that is needed is some monitors. Not for the fact that you cant make decent music without them, its for the fact that they make your life a lot easier. Meaning you can spend less time concentrating on how it will sound on other systems, knowing that you have a flat sound reproduction, leaving you more time to be creative. No you dont need monitors, i havent got any yet, and i do have a realese coming out, but they are still on the top of my list, as these would make my job a hell of a lot easier :doh:

I wasn't replying to any post in particular. So no logic is misplaced there. Other than that I agree with you. But if you get some monitor headphones, that works great in the meantime of getting those elusive monitors. Don't take this stuff so seriously. Is this what anyone does for a living here? I doubt it. :rambo:

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Originally Posted by Iron Lee

I'd even go as far as saying you don't need good monitors. I use normal computer speakers, then I monitor with monitor head phones and make changes from there. You get used to knowing how it will turn out anyway, even if you can't hear it all through crap computer speakers. You know you have some deep bass when you bring it down to 100 hz etc... So really, come on guys, it's all in your ears. Or between your ears. You get more creative and learn more with a financial limit. I've already had tracks of mine mixed into sets. There is a club in Calgary AB. Canada called "Machine" that plays my stuff from time to time. Not bragging just making a point.

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you can make good music structurley on a gramaphone but the reality is if you want to take it to a more scientifical level were u have full control of sonics , depth and how each layer of sound interacts with another you need acurate monitoring, this doesnt really matter a great deal when your first starting out but it definetly wouldnt hurt to get some good monitoring sorted from the get go.

i have no doubt that you have probobly made some good music mate but i expect if you were to send it to a label and they liked it they would have a few niggles with the production and ask you to take it back and return with it sorted, a pair of hi fi speakers and headphones are great as a second reference to see how it is sounding on a typical set up but using these as a main reference is bound to effect your sound in some way, im not trying to sound like the production expert either, i have only just recently installed a pair of monitoring speakers in my set up but i am allready noticing there importance.

You can make good music on anything but the fact remains in todays music world there is a standard in which it must comform too to be released and most importantly if youve taken the time to make the music surely u want to get it sounding as good as possible.

I couldnt go back to using a pair of hi fi speakers now as id feel like i was working in the dark so to speak, like i say though for someone startibg out the first important thing is to get used to making music but if you can access a quality link between the music and your ears at the start it can only be an advantage for your learning.

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Originally Posted by Iron Lee

Don't take this stuff so seriously. Is this what anyone does for a living here? I doubt it. :rambo:

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And we never will unless we take things seriously sometimes ;) , but this is a forum so people are going to put there points across, were not having a go just gettin our opinions out :cool:

why do people pull hifi speakers down ???

good quality hifi speakers wipe the floor with monitors of the same price level - the market is much harsher/competative and so this creates better quality at lower levels.

for eg. - do u think ATC are a monitor company? NO - they make top of the range hifi speakers that studios got onto and so with a bit of marketing decided to bring out the SCM range as monitors too
do you think tannoy reveals are specialist monitors ? NO - they are a pair of £120 bookshelf hifi speakers with a shit amp thrown in, a bit of eq and a pricetag of £400

when you buy a pair of home level monitors - chances are they have totally shite cones in them - yes u can read the blurb that comes with them that says this and that but in REAL hifi speakers the cones are made by the top companies - seas , morel , vifa etc..

you can present to me those silly little graphs on pieces of paper that claim a perfect flat frequency responce , and i can show u 100's of hifi speaker that have the same USELESS graphs - they are plots drawn in a chamber that has no reflections/standing waves using either white/pink noise or a sweeping sine wave - no one on this earth has a studio with no reflections in and no one uses pure sinwaves or white noise to create music. chances are when you put them in your room you will have a huge hump at the bass end and depending on how close you are and how thick your carpet/curtains are , a rather steep rolloff at the top end.

the case of buying monitors so they sound good on more systems - how many top studios have 1 set of monitors??? they usually have 3 pairs - the main monitors in the walls for full frequency monitoring , a midfield pair for balancing the general mix and a pair of nearfields for accurate treble and midrange monitoring - so in effect - 1 set of monitors, no matter how good u think they are will not produce perfect mixes on every system - the only way to do that is by listening to tracks you know and finding out what pair of monitors fit in with your definition of what is right without resorting to EQ. If you get a pair that normal music sounds great on then if you can get your tracks to sound like the pro normal music then you are prob 80% on your way to a good mix.

this isnt a rant by the way , its just the way i see it , and im not talking about cheepo midi hifi speakers either as they should go straight in the bin ;) , im talking about general mid priced speakers to compete with your mackies, ns10's etc. etc. instead of them - why not try out a pair of Ruark/Sonus Faber/Harbeth/ B&W and throw an amp like a Naim / Arcam / Musical fidelity/ Quad etc.. i bet u will tell the difference straight away


http://www.positive-feedback.com/amb...ATCSCM50v2.jpg

mastering studios even use hifi speakers!!!!

if it was diercted at me i wasnt putting hi-fi speakers down as a whole :oops:

im refering to home hi-fi speakers that arent designed for that use and favour some frequencies over others, such as the majority that are found in the home.

im aware of the high end hi fi equipment rivaling well known monitor speakers although its not something im very knowledgeable on

I didnt like that post about not being too serious its not like ppl are doing it for a living comment, not accusing or anything like that but hey there is no doubt the production of music is not just for fun and doing for the spare time. Making music can make you feel better, give you confidence for all sorts of things, express yourself and a million other things but enough of that hehe

I no doubt agree with everyone that monitors are the best, I havent experienced top monitors yet but from the learning base of production so far I have noticed that if you dont have the quality of output coming out when your producing its not going to sound good elsewhere, and you need to be able to clearly identify what exactly your doing to your track.

Anywayz as for booth monitors I am currently setting eyes on the Mackie HR624's - I think they are perfect production monitors for me at the moment can anyone comment on this decision? And as for monitoring headphones, can anyone recommend any affordable yet quality choices?

Thanks again ppl, uz rock! :clap:

Good decision...

Acid U r quite right but indeed if u look into it a good hi-fi amp+ good hi-fi speaker would probably set u off with just as much spending as a Good Nearfield.. so I guess it's a mater of reference... I will probably get more confident comments form users of "known Nearfield" brands then from producers making music on hifh speakers, regardless of how good they might b!!
I feel that it's loads more trial & error going 4 something that I know few people have then for something tested if u know what I mean...

It's true no1 has perfect rooms... precisely from that assumption brands do technical test, based around the more objectively as possible.. I mean it's not at all the perfect way 2 compare speakers but it's the more "perfect" possible !


There is also another good point.. if u know the faults of work system u can eventually work around 'em ... but lets b honest I have been producing for a fair amount of years and I never feel confortable with a mix... I always feel that it's online my best guess with the system I have. I have recently exchanged rooms7 speakers and I know feel totally at lost... I will need some time and close "ear training2 2 start figuring out the problem areas!!

The case presented 2 us was from a start up so I don't think he'll so soon b able 2 really analise what's wrong with his home hi-fi speakers, damn' I don't feel at ease after all the years myself, so it seems that the best guess would b .. get linear monitors, the best u can with your budget, changes are that will b yer "best mistake", those should last and u can learn with 'em and thru' em .. later u can have yer own informed and knowledged opinion to make other choices !

Z