Crap thats sum word. what does it even mean anyway.I dont think i ave used that word since i was in school a good few years ago.
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Crap thats sum word. what does it even mean anyway.I dont think i ave used that word since i was in school a good few years ago.
Isn`t crap a Croatian word?
I think it means better than a rim job.
ha ha. its what courty folk in ireland call there stuff. 'must bring me crap down the field ........'
Quote:
Originally Posted by djfilthmonger
:lol:
AMEN Dirty Bass!!
I play U.K./London techno, hard techno, acid techno, schranz AND progressive house and the occasional breaks. All depends on my mood and where/when I'm spinning. If I played the same style all the time, I'd get sick of it really quick.
I hear u man. i like to experment with breaks and hard techno sumtimes. u know dat choon sesemes treet drum and bass track. i like to mix that to hard choon sounds deadly. i even mix the streets the lights r blinding my eyes with techno. its a bit of a challange as the beat is slow but when then choons r in sync its savageQuote:
Originally Posted by Adrenalin
spot on man, fuk the politics! Just enjoy the music you like and get on with it if you dont like schranz then fine and if you like hard techno then good for you.Quote:
Originally Posted by dirty_bass
thats amazing :clap:Quote:
Originally Posted by Adrenalin
word up
Opinions are like arseholes everyone has oneQuote:
Originally Posted by Miromiric
:lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by djfilthmonger
Quote:
Originally Posted by SummerOfSam
ROFLMAO...
who gives a shit??
Quote:
Originally Posted by crime
its true, why should it matter? i like... no, love both!! :twisted:
People who know there is a difference.Quote:
Originally Posted by crime
I would expect you of all people to understand.
why is this a sticky ?
do we really need to go thru all this again ?
What may not be important to you.
Is to others.
hard techno is schranz
schranz is hard techno
:P
dude, there are waaay more important (and versatile) points to be discussed.. this one has been done to death, and in truth, its subjective with no right or wrong, so whats the point ?Quote:
Originally Posted by SummerOfSam
makin it a sticky does NOT make it an important issue.. its all techno ffs, and some daft label thats been misquoted time & time again is not going to change anyuthing, least of akk the actual music.
dump this thread asap & replace it with a subject that matters.
imo ;)
Compared to vocal house, all techno is rubbish anyway.
lmao @ this being a sticky :lol:
hows about hardcore techno is not gabba aswell :lol:
Can't see you you winning this one, besides it looks like this is more important to you than anyone else. Should you be using stickies to try and enforce your view of what is or is not hard techno, considering your a moderator?Quote:
Originally Posted by SummerOfSam
how can something over 150 - 160 bpm be called techno??? :shock: that type of muzik is much more closer to gabba and hardcore .... ?? for me the 1st such muzik lacks to be called tecchno is the fact thatit laccks definiton and inteligence [but YES schranz can be inteligent and innovative !! and TECHNO even ]..
the originator of the word Schranz [ translation : REAL DANCE MUSIC ] .. Chris Liebing makes it as it;s supose to be .. it;s schranz , >>> .. u can dance to it and it;s hard too .. :devilish: now that can be called techno
unlike the stuff that;s being called schranz at the momnet.. wich i s just blatant headbanging like gabba and hardcore ..
globaly there is a low level of profesionalism regarding production ... 90% of schranz production is just plain bad ... and calling that type of music hardTECHNO just gives techno a bad name .. :roll:
hyper production of shitty [funky loopy bongo, conga ] techno made this possible to happen .. quality is not important as sales anymore ...and that is killing the music // making me think how much is good quality music important anymore ?? and do people deffer it from rest of the shit that;s being put out there ..
and what i dislike also is the fact scrazners are confusing ppl that are new into the music [looks to me many producers are newbies too], taking the name hardtechno and labeling hardtech as hardgroove .. ??? wtf is that about .. ?? plz be REAL !!
hardtechno is much TOUGHER and harder than this thing they call schranz if u ask me ..
their schranz music drifted away from the true meaning of the word ... TECHNO ..and I cannot label it as such ..
it is suposed to be MUSIC >>
PS, i agree with Mark , Patrick and Mita .. too
Could not have said it better.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xavi
And that is why this is a sticky.
Because it is a relevant and important topic for intelligent people to speak on.
Not to come in and say this thread sucks close it.
If you have an opinion on the debate then speak it instead of throwing sucker punches and scurrying off.
xavi, where is th proof that what you say is gospel ? for i supsect it is purely based on opinion.
its subjective.. therefore, there is no right or wrong.
was 'schranz' not jus a descrip[tive word ? like 'funky' or 'minamil' or 'hard' or 'deep' ?
It's not about winning or loosing.Quote:
Originally Posted by kebabman
It's about education.
I am not standing on a pulpit screaming.
It is a debate.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SummerOfSam
i dont think it is a debate.. i think its a massive collection of cross wires.. from the day the word was uttered, and forever more, 'schranz' will be a mammoth running joke.. not the music that has been tagged, the word itself.
thread of the year
its nerarly as good as the one in The Dungeon..
It's gotten confusing lately.
The main confusing is between "Hardtechno" from Germany, which is what "Schranz" evolved into and "Hard Techno" from the UK, which is what Mark EG for example is doing.
So here's a little history lesson on what went on in Germany the last 5 years (again, note the difference between "Hard Techno" and "Hardtechno" or else this won't make sense).
When Schranz started in Germany, it became a huge hype. A year or two into the hype, Schranz as a word became unpopular and the music started to become soft and turned into what is now Techhouse. That aside it also started to suck. That's pretty much when I surfaced and started doing ridiculously hard 'Schranz' with the sole purpose of shocking and protesting this new, softer direction the music had taken.
The work of ViperXXL, Wittekind and myself gave birth to a new hype. 'Schranz' played at 150 bpm. Back then our sets mostly consisted of mostly UK Hard Techno and some of the harder German and French stuff. Think Glenn Wilson, Cold Dust, The Anxious, WJH, Stigmata, etc.
Since we didn't see it as Schranz, for lack of a better word, we called our music "Hard Techno" which was written as "Hardtechno" in order to keep Germans from writing it as "Harter Techno". (This was shortly before the iraq war and in Germany people tried to avoid english words as protest against the US or some shit).
So from then on everybody called the hard and fast stuff "Hardtechno". A bunch of new producers showed up, some good (Arkus P., OBI, Seema at the time), but most of them sucked. People started producing and djing on speeds of 155bpm and up to make their tracks sound harder. This of course wasn't gonna work, but like anyone ever listened to me....
People started stealing loops from each other, overcompressing the f*ck out of their productions, so you basically get some muddy drumloop shit with no highs which pumps for 2 monutes, then theres a break with some random noises and some angry sounding movie sample "haha now prepare to die". Of course that's when the compressor lets go, so the highs start screaming and it messes up you hearing, then the beat comes back in and it's back to the old mud sound.
Now, 3 years later, the scene has devolved into something I don't want to have a part in anymore. Hardtechno partys start at 160+bpm and end at... 160+bpm. NO WONDER party people get sick of this shit. Hell I love headbanging as much as anyone, but I feel insulted by the stupidity and lack of creativity of Hardtechno productions lately.
I pretty much quit playing any of that stuff in 2004 and worked my way towards a more Industrial Hardcore like sound, which in my opinion is far closer to UK Hard Techno than anything else. Names like Manu LeMalin, Daisy, Rude Awakening, Lenny Dee, Peaky Pounder, Ophidian, etc come to mind.
I got into hot water for it, I was threatened last year by DJs from the Hardtechno scene, that if I continued "opening the doors to our market for the the Hardcore guys, it would be the end of Hardtechno, because one can't compete with DJs like Lenny and businesses like Third Movement". Not that I cared. There was even a call for boycott against me. Promoters were threatened, that if they book me or any one from my agency, they would no longer get headliners from a certain agency.
So I started my own agency and right now we're promoting this new Industrial Techno style and building up a new scene. A scene where there will be no room for bpm contests, cokehead artists who mistake themselves for god, calls for boycott and all the other crap that ruined Hardtechno.
At least that's my vision and mission for the next few years.
Ideally there will be partys that start with Techno, move up to Hard Techno and from there go harder and harder until you end up with Industrial Hardcore.
yeah, so basically it's all just hard techno then ?
sorted!
if i understood this ocrrectly, there are some good and some bad producers from within this "hardtechno" school?
:clap:
the best of wishes to ya Mr Amok... please continue to do 'your thing' as it is one of the few that matters.
Exactly. Can't argue with that at all. Sorry Sam but if you don't think what is categorised as schranz as hard techno then good for you. Pretty pointless though trying to think you can tell others what is or is not hard techno. Anyone who thinks hard techno has to remain between 135 and 145 bpm, be "intelligent" and have soul or whatever is clearly bonkers.
Add to that you agreed that fifth direction (Matame 02) was a great piece of vinyl, well I would say that three quarters of it are by what you would call schranz producers??? And that's not hard techno?
Fair play to ya mate, that`s one of the most constructive and honest statements about a scene I`ve heard for a while.Quote:
Originally Posted by DJAmok
Good luck to you.
i mean im one of hard techno's biggest advocates, and i really, REALLY dislike most schranz, still love early wittekind ep's but now i find most of it a complete joke. But this thread is inane, condascending and certainly wasnt put up with the intention of a debate, it was "this is this, not that, accept it", which is a big no no, even i can see that and ive been guilty of some true schranz slagging in the past, the difference being ive made it known to those involved in the scene why i felt like i did about the sound. Now it just doesnt bother me, its not an area i work in or every am likely too, and im pleased with that
if it doesnt bother what your doing directly, then chill out. It's like all the minimal bashing, if your not involved in that area, or even like it, then whats the point in slagging it? we are all alot more grown up on here than we were 4 years ago, lets start acting like it
can we not just call it all hard dance music and hen define it by the bpm? :eyes:
it`s all techno.
well i was stating my oppion,,, figured thatis the purpose of this thread by no means am i claiming something is truth or not i 'm only sying how i feel about the matter..dont take me wrong there is some great scranz out there ...and will be for some time... the whole divide thing is confusing,,,Quote:
Originally Posted by module
my point is this new stuff 150 bpm is a world of it;s own,,, known as schranz... very different from what it originated from to be called hardtechno...
but still it;s only my oppinion and not the truth ...
the truth is out there :lol:
WowQuote:
Originally Posted by kebabman
I find it amazing how some good points are brought to light in here.
By well established producers and mates about the board, yet you choose to single me out in this discussion, I am not the only one here who is relaying the topic of this thread.
Especially one of the best points by Ben himself.
As far as Matame is concerned Jav is a friend of mine and I would support if he put a fart on vinyl out.
I never said I was against schranz or what is associated with.
I am against certain people involved with that scene trying to redefine what is hard techno.
So next time research what I type previous to looking like a derranged soccer fan saying yeah dude schranz rules you suck.
And Module, leave me be, we do not want a repeat of before, I've gone through the mill with you before, you also need to lay off the personal attack. Obviously there are people here that agree with my point so there is no use in you saying it is ....useless.
You are a hard techno producer are you not?
In your ads for your nights you say you are the underrated hard techno lad right?
How would you feel if you were classified as hardgroove?
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJAmok
:thumbsup: :thumbsup: Really good post - thanks for that -m prob done more than the rest of the entire thread to clear up the confusion between the two in my mind.
Good luck with the future plans - def the way forward imo!
Quote:
Originally Posted by SummerOfSam
no.. i make all sorts of techno.. from clicky bleeps to over compressed loop crap ;)
and tbh man ? i couldnt give 2 or 3 flying f**ks what ayone classes me as. if you think all i do is play Amok record after Amok record, then it shows you have no idea whatsoever of what i play.
i play everything from Amok to the Rolling Stones when i play out.. i been playing old house & techno from back round 92-95 on my monthly sundays.. last perpetual, i played mostly Sims/Broom/User type records. the previous, it was an Ableton set using my own loops. the one before that, it was a bit of everything, even old Hardfloor acid trax from like 93..
man, it aint all about your opinion here, i think Xavi had some great points, but i dont have to agree with them. its ALL subjective. jus like production.. there is no right or wrong, jus opinion.
and i have no beef with you. i jus dont agree with all your opinions. as you dont agree with all mine. which i think IS a good thing.
is chris liberator schranz?
I don't really see how you can say he is tbh - acid techno surely mate.
:lol: :lol: :lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by kai
sorry m8.. was just tryin to take the piss!
Ha ha - had a sneaky feelin' you might be mate, but you never know do ya - heard sillier things from people in the past. ;)
Quote:
Originally Posted by module
Funny thing is I never said that.
You are just using me as a scapegoat for your points.
Me and Xavi are not saying anything different.
Nor am I and Amok for that matter.
I never brought any opinion about schranz into this.
I don't even have much of a negative opinion on it.
It is it's own entity.
I am just against a handful of schranz producers and enthusiasts
Trying to redefine what is hard techno and trying to classify what is hard techno as hardgroove.
That is what this sticky is about.
thats cool.. and no, you never said that.. bit of a tirade i admit & aplologise for.. i jus get etchy when ppl assume all i play is bang bang.. and from time to time go off.. my bad.
anyhoo.. yeah, its the classification i dont get. i jus dont see how it helps tbh. i personally jus see techno in levels of heavyness.
but yeah.. cool. i suppose if theres one here it saves having 13 across 3 other forums innit.
i love the schranz, i do.
What's the name of these tracks?Quote:
Originally Posted by SummerOfSam
I haven't read the whole thread so this has probably been said already, but surely the main problem Sam is just that 'hard techno' is on the surface of it too broad a name for the specific genre you're so passionate about.
People can be forgiven for hearing schranz - thinking it's hard, it's techno... so it's hard techno. If they give a shit about it they'll know the difference, if they don't surely the term they use to describe the sound isn't worth worrying too much about?