why are distributions keep going broke?

[Internal Error Records]

downloads dont put music on vinyl.

[viagratek]

[/url]http://www.groovegate.com

[Ritzi Lee]

downloads dont put music on vinyl.

Sounds like a Bruce Lee statement:
"Boards don't hit back!"


:lol:



But even when downloads are not on vinyl,
you can still make some benefit as the owner of your music.
The only problem is that people still didn't think out a system,
where we all can survive from this....


Poeple should elaborate.
Not repeating, pissing and moaning about the problems again and again.
That's what i was hopig opening this topic. So we maybe could find out what's going on firstly. And secondly if we can solve problems. :)

[Internal Error Records]

technically speaking every time you publicly spin a record you are stealing from the artist/label.

retail purchased music is legally intended for private use.

there is no difference between publicly spinning a piece of vinyl or an illegal download because the artist isnt being compensated.


you might as well sue the makers of Final Scratch if you are going to try and shoot down illegal download sites. they are all part of the same market.

the only answer is to adjust your business strategy to include these new factors.

[Ritzi Lee]

there is no difference between publicly spinning a piece of vinyl or an illegal download because the artist isnt being compensated.

In Holland we're just doing a testcase with a system where you can give your repertoire to the Buma Stemra. Each party, club, shops where music is used; these people have to pay a percentage or amount for using music. Each time the artists can warn the Buma Stemra their music is played by delivering a repertoire...

This system is not really perfect yet, because not everyone delivers a repertoire. So it's still difficult to calculate a kind of compensation.

Don't you have an organisation in the US yourself where they keep hold of this?

Maybe there is: But then people are not yet well informed how to use it.

[Internal Error Records]

theft is theft is theft.

in the underground you simply cant survive without getting comfortable with it.

i know for a fact that all the clubs in Disney Worlds resorts keep play logs and once a month the club managers sent money to the publisher of the records that were spun in the venue.

back in the early 90's techno dj's were obcessed with telling the capitalist music industry to **** off. now there is alot of us sweating profit margins. yes i am one of them too. maybe we have strayed a little too far from the path.

[jon connor]

i think we all may as well start practising our live sets, to perfofm that way ? or is there a chance for vynyl and distribution to servive, well i think there is and im confident, wot distributers and every 1 in the vynyl indusrtry needs to look at is, a new market approach, mabey the vynyl its self ,jaz it up a bit, develope new vynyl, witch can hold more tracks without sound reduction etc, the vynyl its self, i no we have picture discs etc we have had for years, but anyone will tell ya the sound quality is normaly crap, also expensive to stamp,or mabey find a new material witch can hold diffrent file formats and still be played like a vynyl will speicial needles developed etc, as for the distribution you wont be able to stop online shopping,. also another big blow to small record shops was hmv and virgin , they also have had a big inpact on the destruction of small outlets.but its this day and age doods like all small shops grocerys etc ,they are all taken out by the big wallmarts and superstores.

personaly i dont want to see vynyl go under, we are all righting it off to quick, manufactures need to modernise the vynyl,i dont mean cd mixing ill scream if someone says that i regard that as swearing. ;) no wot i want is to see a development in the vynyl itsself, if we start here it might be a good start. lets just look at it, people just want more for there money these days. playing decks is not just playing music its an artform when perfected,. digital generation is well and truly here even the multy million pound record industries are feeling it to,its not just the underground. well any way thats my point of view personaly i think the vynyl industry is due for a shake up, development is needed, but again that begs the question who is willing to pay for it, if i won the lottery i certainly would be launching a load of cash in to the development, but we can only dream !

[dirty_bass]

personaly i dont want to see vynyl go under, we are all righting it off to quick, manufactures need to modernise the vynyl,i dont mean cd mixing ill scream if someone says that i regard that as swearing

Vinyl is shit, as a medium it is old.
In terms of manipulation, the new next generation CD players are spot on.
No one is going to invest money to try to develope the phonographic disc, as it is s destructive medium and not the best way to record sound.
Every time you play it, you damage the vinyl, and the needle, little by little.
The problem then is, moving releases to CD format. Much cheaper to produce, much better quality masters, smaller, lighter, reducing costs and increasing margins across the board.
If the price of the high end CD players would only come down I personally would gladly embrace the death of vinyl and the beginning of a change in the way our products work.

[Ritzi Lee]

2 dirty bass:

I still have some difficulties trying to image you walk into a recordshop;
and only seeying releases on CD.

And is it really true that the production costs for doing CD's is cheaper??
Do you have any price references?

[dirty_bass]

Yeah, it`s hard to imagine a record shop full of CD`s, but we can`t hang on to the past, this is TECHNOlogy Music after all.

Current prices I have been quoted.

For 1000 CD`s
Including
Mastering from production ready DAT
Test CD
Glass Mastering
The printing of all paper parts
Jewel boxes/trays
On body 2 colour printing
Shrink wrapping

£795

[SlavikSvensk]

And is it really true that the production costs for doing CD's is cheaper??
Do you have any price references?

pressing cds is infinitely cheaper than pressing vinyl...think about it...a little piece of optical plastic versus a hulking mass of black vinyl...a little paper cover inside a dinky plastic cover versus a massive cardboard sleeve...one weighs close to nothing, the other is heavy as sh*t...

...if your margins are tight, and people one day are willing to exclusively spin cds instead of vinyl, it would makes financial sense for labels and distributors to scrap vinyl, sad as that would be.

personally, i love vinyl, but i'm a nerdy collector and like all kinds of anachronistic sh*t.

[Ritzi Lee]

And these CD's;
It should be nice if there is a coded system,
where it's not possible to strip it down on harddisk directly.
So only people with really advanced equipment can do this.
For reducing the risk of illegal copying.

Anyway what's the point for illegal copying if you can get the CD's for a really cheap retail price. £3,- or something.

[Internal Error Records]

the entire information age from 1920 until now the world has embraced vinyl.

the djs who love vinyl dont love it because its cheaper.

you cant put a price on quality or love.

its cost cutting and people who arent committed to vinyl that switch to cds.

god bless them, let them go. no loss to the vinyl people.

true vinyl sales havent changed in 20 years. its a medium for people who obcess it.

its time to accept that we live in a world of 'cd dj's and 'vinyl dj's and neither is a threat to, insult to the other.

[dirty_bass]

don`t be a fool. Vinyl needs to die.
Do we still plough the land with ox?
do you communicate via smoke signals or with a telephone (or the internet?)
do you listen to music on an old 1950`s mono, radio with single speaker output, no tone control? or a stereo?
??
Let the past go, it`s ok, it won`t hurt really.

[Internal Error Records]

don`t be a fool. Vinyl needs to die.
Do we still plough the land with ox?
do you communicate via smoke signals or with a telephone (or the internet?)
do you listen to music on an old 1950`s mono, radio with single speaker output, no tone control? or a stereo?
??
Let the past go, it`s ok, it won`t hurt really.

i suppose its asking to much for to see a quality such as FAITH in a man whose location is 'london the big shit hole'

good luck in all you do.

[jon connor]

[quote="dirty_bass"]don`t be a fool. Vinyl needs to die.
Do we still plough the land with ox?
do you communicate via smoke signals or with a telephone (or the internet?)
do you listen to music on an old 1950`s mono, radio with single speaker output, no tone control? or a stereo?
??
Let the past go, it`s ok, it won`t hurt really.[/quotyes

yes it bloody well will. your takeing away the raw skill and art work of a proper dj, ive used cd j`s etc ok for my own tracks yes, but they are s.h.i.t compared to mixing vynyl. your taking away the whole concept of dj performance. wot raw skill can you do with a cd, ummm could it be the on board effects ? oh s.h.i.t weve got a good beat counter so any joe bloggs can use and mix. im a hardcore vynyl lover take it away and i wont be playing cds or useing cdjs i will be using final scratch or just playing live instead, i will not serender to cdjs. only time i will use 1 is for along side the decks when i want to give 1 of my new tracks a test drive.

in any case vynyl has a dirty more grity sound and thats underground.and i no dirty bass you will say no its not digital is etc etc, but i had a course on this in collage and im going to dig it out, about how vynyl is diffrent to cd. do a test your self guys like i did in collage on a rig over 5 k. get the same track on cd, and vynyl play them each, then cum back and tell me wot sounds better. i already no coz anologue kicks digitals ass in sound quality. ;)

this is killing me i will have nighmares tonight about the death of vynyl :cry: there like jewelry to me to preisious.

[dirty_bass]

I have put more of my life into techno than most, and during my free party years, risked arrest, inprisonment, the destruction of my soundsystem, and when the gangs muscled in, my life.
I have more faith than most probably.
But I also accept and embrace change, and always live in the now, and look to the future.

[dirty_bass]

haha, vinyl has a smaller frequency range than CD. Bad stereo imaging and the list goes on, it is in no way "better" on a 5k rig in comparison.
My live PA is generated digitally, and the audio quality is always so much fuller and clearer in comparison to the DJ`s I have just followed.

RAW dj skill is in the mixing and eqing.
The actual beatmatching isn`t a skill, it`s a mechanical process that gets in the way of making a good mix.
Personally if I could have a tune instantly qued up and beatmatched with some magic piece of kit, I would buy it straight away, because I know and accept it would give me more time to do the important and skillful and artistic part of DJing, ie, the eqing, sorting the mix point, tricks etc.

Anyone and their gran can beatmatch, and a good DJ it does not make.

[Internal Error Records]

risked arrest,

youve never been arrested for techno? aweeeee... once you get arrested come back to the conversation.


dood. just let it go. you are coming in swing shit to people who love vinyl. vinyl is dead preaching is unwanted. you qualify as a flame starter for no reason other than to hear yourself.

once you get arrested for techno, do loose 5 grand in sound gear, do have a few guns pointed at you, and then invest 5 grand more into a VINYL record label, than maybe you will be qualified to participate.

[fresh_an_funky_design]

dont get me wrong I LOVE VINYL, but technology will always progress, and for those who arn't willing to progress and change with the times will get left behind.

For example as much as we all hate mp3's i've just sorted out mp3 distribution for my label through trackitdown.net. Bear in mind there are no set up costs, and if someone buys all four tunes of a release i still get the same amount that i would of my distributor.

If techno is too survive we cant live in the past, we've got too move forward and embrace new technologies.