djing or lack of???

[gumpy green]

right has anyone here ever seen a umek demonstration ? well i have in estern block records manchester a few year ago. im telling ya. 4 decks doing stuff you only dream of. he ripped the whole shop appart after a all night gig at the music box, cuts double scratch dropings and sum mad stuff with his hands with 4 decks that blew my head off! ( now thats techno turntablism.....also christian varelea another it seems there more of these kinda djs abroad mabey we just lazy bastards in this country and want it easy play sum records on 2 decks or ya lap top or ya cdj`s wot ever is least effort collect ya cash **** off! lazyness its called. ;)

aye lazyness on some folk parts......an folk on here are always saying how techno is about pushing shit forward.....its not just the hardware and software shit that needs pushed.....i mean i could name a few djs thet havent progressed much in 5 yrs....ask yourselve this- have you? if not then start working on it, if yes....BIGUPS.

yup its just soo easy to just let the records do the work for you.....totally agree with ya ther.....id rather see folk useing the records as tools...

also- if umek is doing all this crazy stuff , how come when i saw him it was pretty standard stuff, with the odd cutter/transform fx thrown in..
is it the case that that theyll go for it in bedrooms etc but wont do it live?..if so, that needs looking into too......

id be interested to hear a umek set if he does this stuff cos ive a couple(not much) and i never spotted any of this going down......

i wish to be prooved wrong.....i so wanna be wrong......would luv to see it

[dirty_bass]

I think the sound of a record being played backwards and forwards relatively quickly in time to the music is not exactly progression.
It`s ooooooooooold shit.
Not exactly a new sound is it.
Heard one scratch, heard em all.
there is so much more you can do with technology.
I think the whole turntablism is more about Ego than music.
A DJ is there to play the music that the people wanna hear, and make it a little exciting to enhance the dance ambience.
Wanking off endlessly over a record to say "hey, look at me, I`m great" , can be tiresome.
Good music is first and foremost, the most important thing.
Unfortunately, too many DJ`s are making music, well, loops, and this is sooo boring the only way to make it interesting is to do shit over the top of it.

[koma]

last 2 times i heard Umek he was killing the music with bunch of fx's..

but in 2001. when I saw him live he was great.. plus much better selection of music than today (IMO)

cristian varela, yeah.. some amazing mixes from him can be found on net..

anybody heard Headroom live on 6 decks?

ps. the number of turntables doesnt really matter to me.. dj with some knowledge can create magic even on just two..

[gumpy green]

I think the sound of a record being played backwards and forwards relatively quickly in time to the music is not exactly progression.
It`s ooooooooooold shit.
Not exactly a new sound is it.
Heard one scratch, heard em all.
there is so much more you can do with technology.
I think the whole turntablism is more about Ego than music.
A DJ is there to play the music that the people wanna hear, and make it a little exciting to enhance the dance ambience.
Wanking off endlessly over a record to say "hey, look at me, I`m great" , can be tiresome.
Good music is first and foremost, the most important thing.
Unfortunately, too many DJ`s are making music, well, loops, and this is sooo boring the only way to make it interesting is to do shit over the top of it.

skraching is only a little older than techno, no doubt, so i totally disagre with ya on the first point....you can cut ANY sample in infinate no of ways so it can always be flipped differnent.....ive got records made entilry from skracthing samples....and in no way do the sound the same...the drummin is differnet from the bassline i assure you.

my dad says the same about techno- it all sounds the same.....its maybe he just dont understand it...maybe you havent looked deep enuf into turntablism.....

i dont think you can say - "there is so much more you can do with technology."..ther are infinate possiblities with each...

turntablism=ego.... lol..... just look at flare, hes one of the best in skratchers and doesnt even perform(only time you hear him is in bedrooms etc), and if you were into turntabism you would see that very little have ego's...they do it for the luv.

Wanking off endlessly over a record to say "hey, look at me, I`m great" , can be tiresome. yup totally, but flippin it so it sounds differnent(in a good way) maybe once every 4 tracks for the period of a break wouldnt......

yup ther are alot of loops comin out but they have ther uses.......and i do agree ther need to be a little more thought going into alot of folks work.....its just as nice to hear a well made SONG.

[Stuart]

last 2 times i heard Umek he was killing the music with bunch of fx's..

..

Thats Basically what dave clarke does with the djm 600 which pisses me off.

Hes a great dj but I hate the efx that are contiually used on each track, he now rarely mixes just ends up with a loop from the current record and then brings the next one in on efx.

[jon connor]

right has anyone here ever seen a umek demonstration ? well i have in estern block records manchester a few year ago. im telling ya. 4 decks doing stuff you only dream of. he ripped the whole shop appart after a all night gig at the music box, cuts double scratch dropings and sum mad stuff with his hands with 4 decks that blew my head off! ( now thats techno turntablism.....also christian varelea another it seems there more of these kinda djs abroad mabey we just lazy bastards in this country and want it easy play sum records on 2 decks or ya lap top or ya cdj`s wot ever is least effort collect ya cash **** off! lazyness its called. ;)

aye lazyness on some folk parts......an folk on here are always saying how techno is about pushing shit forward.....its not just the hardware and software shit that needs pushed.....i mean i could name a few djs thet havent progressed much in 5 yrs....ask yourselve this- have you? if not then start working on it, if yes....BIGUPS.

yup its just soo easy to just let the records do the work for you.....totally agree with ya ther.....id rather see folk useing the records as tools...

also- if umek is doing all this crazy stuff , how come when i saw him it was pretty standard stuff, with the odd cutter/transform fx thrown in..
is it the case that that theyll go for it in bedrooms etc but wont do it live?..if so, that needs looking into too......

id be interested to hear a umek set if he does this stuff cos ive a couple(not much) and i never spotted any of this going down......

i wish to be prooved wrong.....i so wanna be wrong......would luv to see it

yea grumpy i aint heard much action when on in events much ....but as mark explains in post above we tend to mix quite diffrent wen live on the turntables its like a play safe game. wen you got the dance floor flying it seems silly to start messing about. personaly i think umek has no need to deliver his skills and tricks no more due to the fact of his now popular superstar status, but trust me geeza if you ever see him do it will blow you away. dave clarke another now this comes back to marks point again. yes dave blew me away but i found wen at a gig in cardiff with him a few year ago his decks and turntable work was exellent but i found the crowd dident no wot to do with them selves on the dance floor.there was no flow he did a kinda djs dj set. it was great for me to watch and learn but i also learnt it disruppted the crowd sending them into confusion and no general flow in the club.
i think the main thing is to have overall control and general individuality in the set there are many tricks and stuff i do myself but i tend to cut them down wen on a more profesional gig, rather than lets say a free party.

there was a great demonstration on here a while back of dj ogi its a good techno demonstration keeping things simple and overall control .

Dj Ogi live in club Boogaloo part I
Dj Ogi live in club Boogaloo part II
Dj Ogi live in club Boogaloo part III
Dj Ogi live in club Boogaloo part IV

[dirty_bass]

skraching is only a little older than techno, no doubt, so i totally disagre with ya on the first point....you can cut ANY sample in infinate no of ways so it can always be flipped differnent.....ive got records made entilry from skracthing samples....and in no way do the sound the same...the drummin is differnet from the bassline i assure you.

my dad says the same about techno- it all sounds the same.....its maybe he just dont understand it...maybe you havent looked deep enuf into turntablism.....

i dont think you can say - "there is so much more you can do with technology."..ther are infinate possiblities with each...

turntablism=ego.... lol..... just look at flare, hes one of the best in skratchers and doesnt even perform(only time you hear him is in bedrooms etc), and if you were into turntabism you would see that very little have ego's...they do it for the luv.

Wanking off endlessly over a record to say "hey, look at me, I`m great" , can be tiresome. yup totally, but flippin it so it sounds differnent(in a good way) maybe once every 4 tracks for the period of a break wouldnt......

yup ther are alot of loops comin out but they have ther uses.......and i do agree ther need to be a little more thought going into alot of folks work.....its just as nice to hear a well made SONG.

Well, I grew up through turntablism, but that was years ago, I like the Invisible Scratch Pickles a bit at the mo, and most of the crew I was with during the early hardcore/jungle years, were proper funkateers.

But it`s just old to me. Im not saying it`s a bad thing, but I really don`t think it goes with techno.
If it did, there would be more producers programming scratching into their tracks.
I think it sounds cheesy.

I think what you are doing on the decks is pretty cool, but any more would be overdoing it.

And as for turntablists not being egotistical. I think ALL Djing is to a certain level, ego driven.
I mean, how the hell did glorified juke-boxes get to such an elevated level in this day an age?
All we are doing is playing other peoples music, and finally the hype of the 90`s is slowly going away. Lets not overblow what it is.

[jon connor]

woooooooooooooo!!! sorry guys links no longer in action.

[gumpy green]

Well, I grew up through turntablism, but that was years ago, I like the Invisible Scratch Pickles a bit at the mo, and most of the crew I was with during the early hardcore/jungle years, were proper funkateers.

But it`s just old to me. Im not saying it`s a bad thing, but I really don`t think it goes with techno.
If it did, there would be more producers programming scratching into their tracks.
I think it sounds cheesy.

I think what you are doing on the decks is pretty cool, but any more would be overdoing it.

And as for turntablists not being egotistical. I think ALL Djing is to a certain level, ego driven.
I mean, how the hell did glorified juke-boxes get to such an elevated level in this day an age?
All we are doing is playing other peoples music, and finally the hype of the 90`s is slowly going away. Lets not overblow what it is.

good debate man..

yup, i agree that cutting over most techno does sound shite.....well just REALLY hard to make it sound good....i struggle to do it.... thats why i usually drop a hiphop/hardtek/noize track to do it over and only do it when i think the crowd need a min rest....oh and yes skratch vocal etc over techno tracks sound cheesy, starts to sound like hard hoose.

thanks about my djing.....i plan on doing more tricks but wanna make em sound cleaner so it does sound like less........more is less ;) . Hopefully juggle two looked groove but the listener wouldnt even know unless they saw......would just sound like a remix or whatever loop.

Ego- a bit.....id be lying if i didnt say i like the fact im up ther.....but i still would do it even if i never left the house....i honestly luv djing so much....its my passion...b4 techno.

An yup how the fuk do they get away with " glorified juke-boxes @ such an elevated level in this day an age?"...totally agree, it needs to stop.

[dirty_bass]

yeah, was a good debate.
you certianly know your stuff anyway, I`m sure whatever you do will work, cos you got your feet on the ground.
There are however a lot of eedjits out there who may just wank themselves off a bit too far.

As for coming up with Seb, unfortunately, I got bookings that weekend so I can`t come party with you boys (which I was looking forward to).
But I may be able to come up with Jeff.

[koma]

there was a great demonstration on here a while back of dj ogi its a good techno demonstration keeping things simple and overall control .

Dj Ogi live in club Boogaloo part I
Dj Ogi live in club Boogaloo part II
Dj Ogi live in club Boogaloo part III
Dj Ogi live in club Boogaloo part IV

oh man, everyone on earth has this mix - except me
but I was there, so I could witnessed it in first row ;)

[gumpy green]

yeah, was a good debate.
you certianly know your stuff anyway, I`m sure whatever you do will work, cos you got your feet on the ground.
There are however a lot of eedjits out there who may just wank themselves off a bit too far.

As for coming up with Seb, unfortunately, I got bookings that weekend so I can`t come party with you boys (which I was looking forward to).
But I may be able to come up with Jeff.

thanks man. again agree-to many edjits...i remeber one free party we let some djs on the rig and all they did was spin backs...like every track...prob more than that.....it was a classic wanking off toomuch..... :dontevengothere:

pity you cant come up with seb, hope your booking goes well tho.....any far far away special gig?

aye defo try come with jeff.... 7th may......

canny wait for both of them ther gonna be such good sets....

oh, .ive still to get all the audio and photos from your gig to u ....got em on pc just need to burn a copy and get it to you....

[gumpy green]

there was a great demonstration on here a while back of dj ogi its a good techno demonstration keeping things simple and overall control .

Dj Ogi live in club Boogaloo part I
Dj Ogi live in club Boogaloo part II
Dj Ogi live in club Boogaloo part III
Dj Ogi live in club Boogaloo part IV

oh man, everyone on earth has this mix - except me
but I was there, so I could witnessed it in first row ;)

soulseek brutha...im sure itll be ther.

[marginmaster]

i think scratching can sound quality in a techno set, as long as its done well. guys like Damage, Clarke, space djz and claude young do it and it sounds great, not overdone but it can spice things up i reckon.

[recoil]

Perhaps people (including me) take music way too seriously, it's still entertainment..

The only turntablism I heard from the Space DJz is Ben Long taking 2 Adam Beyer's Vocal Image and play with them :) The rest they just mix very fast with lots of scratches and fader work..

[AcidTrash]

I just wanna hear good tunes, there`s too many effects and scratching and arsing about these days.
Mainly cos of all the loopypoop that`s getting released.

Too true, and clubbers can't dance to a dj scratching it up on a deck.
I also hate the DJM 600 being used in clubs. The Dj's can't resist to use some of its stupid effects. It should be about the mixing and the music. Not look at me see what I can do. Leave that to the DMC championship where people go to see that.
Yes its impressive but not for a dance floor.

Totally agree. I really get pissed off when a guy I know who waits for the messed up bits in cluster tunes and then applies an effect on the DJM 600 and then mimes like he's making that happen. What a tool.

[jon connor]

bit of scatching over techno ..chek these out ....a couple of clips off a recent set ;)

http://supertech.altervista.org/scratch%20demo%201.wav

http://supertech.altervista.org/scratch%20demo%202.wav

gota av a blast! short and sweat is just enough i think.....see if you guys like.

[gumpy green]

bit of scatching over techno ..chek these out ....a couple of clips off a recent set ;)

http://supertech.altervista.org/scratch%20demo%201.wav

http://supertech.altervista.org/scratch%20demo%202.wav

gota av a blast! short and sweat is just enough i think.....see if you guys like.

first one sounds ok......second one- no audio??

the cuts are flowing over the beat quite nice but the skratches are very very basic....ther "baby" and "stab" skratches. Im wanting to hear double timed orbits and various combos that involve extreme musical timing. double timed record movements mixed with half time fader cuts....

good stuff putting the audio up......im gonna get some audio up to support my stand point..

Props out john........

[gumpy green]

here 2 examples froma recent set i played @ jakN,edinburgh(dec)


1. This example shows jugglin with a beat stutter fx b4 the kicks com in, just to tease the crowd a couple of bars

2.This one shows some cutting over hardtek and the transition(sample trigger fx) from techno to hardtek........some flaring and chirps going on....still no wher near the level i want within techno.

i shall post some more examples to strenghing my points.....

[gumpy green]

btw way the skatach one is under 3.5mb and the juggle is only 1.6mb so will dl quick...