i didnt say it was limited to hip hop dude, i said it was old hip hop shit... which it is... people using it in techno have developed the idea from seeing the hip hop kids doing, so to feel that its doing something new is not right, because its not, its impressive sure and probably a wikid feeling to pull off, ut its not doing anything to further djing and there are so other many tricks that dont take as much pre-thought i.e putting stickers on ur records, that make the room go off just as well if not more

but i agree this post is going nowhere, im out!