METROPOLIS

[death on a stick]

Some of you people need to spend a little less effort on judging and a lot more effort on understanding.

With regard to Fritz Lang's "Metropolis" - I've never seen the full original version, but from what I have seen it commands full respect. It's a truly innovative work.

With regard to Jeff Mills' alternative soundtrack - I was lucky enough to see the screening of this along with the film at the Royal Festival Hall last year. It's excellent, particularly when combined with the visual element. Some of the timings are superb. It's a real shame that it won't get a DVD release.

There is no "Jeff Mills connection" to get, one thing merely inspired the other, but I think that has already been explained.

With regard to Jeff Mills DJ fee. Yes, it's high. Also high is the interest his name creates on a line up. Also high is the number of people who attend a night because he is playing. Also high is the amount of money promoters make out of his name. Also high is that very factor on promoters' list of priorities when booking him. Thus, his fee is justified, in my opinion. The market leads. Do you think that if Mills dropped his fee by 90%, that the promoters would drop the ticket price? No. So, as he is being exploited, so he deserves to gain as much as possible from that exploitative situation. Do you think he believes he deserves £10,000 for playing records? I doubt it, but that's not the only thing that needs taking into account when you are at his level in the game.

When any one of you inspire such interest, when any one of you has blown people away night after night across every continent in the world, when any one of you have produced such a unique and groundbreaking body of work, when any one of you have inspired thousands of people to take up DJing and production...then you can come on here and justifiably bitch about it.

The guy has been doing his thing since the 80s. Some of you people here were still in nappies and most if not all of you will fail completely to achieve a fraction of what he has - so learn to have some f.ucking respect. eyes without a face - you do a remarkable job of revealing your youthful ignorance. Perhaps you ought to go and gain more of an understanding of techno music before spouting off your ill thought out crap across this and other forums. Your narrow mindedness and misguided demeanour never ceases to amaze me.

And before anyone wants to accuse me of being some sort of fanboy - don't bother. I just know what I'm talking about, have observed his and many other careers over the past 11 or 12 years, have had the respect for the music and it's makers to learn something of their histories - and am perfectly able to acknowledge simple and obvious truths such as the fact that, for example "Mills ain't as good as he used to be" etc. etc.

One unfortunate factor in all this is the fact - yes, FACT - that the old saying "you had to be there", is absolutely true. For those that witnessed Mills at his height, there was nobody, and there still is nobody, who ever came close to what he was doing in the mid-90s. Sorry if you missed it, but just cos you don't understand doesn't give you the right to diss a man who more than anyone else has shaped the way techno exists today. Not that I am saying his influence has produced a utopian scenario - of course it hasn't. Judging by some of the diabolical garbage that gets discussed on this forum his legacy looks extremely tarnished - but whose fault is that? His, or the hordes of people who chose to imitate rather than innovate?

[BritishMurderBoy]

bloody good post mate: i agreee 100%

[BritishMurderBoy]

i think he must of snorted 50 bags of coke

saying that shows you lack one key piece of info: none of the detroit heads do drugs be it chemical or natural.....

[death on a stick]

saying that shows you lack one key piece of info: none of the detroit heads do drugs be it chemical or natural.....

As someone who was once passed a spliff rolled and partially smoked by Juan Atkins, I'm afraid I have to disagree with you there. Atkins is something of an anomaly though, rumoured to have had major problems with hard drugs, crack or smack or both or neither, the details are vague but it's fairly well known he's had problems. In fact it is said that Mike Banks had to step in to prevent Atkins selling Metroplex to fund drug debts, hence the proliferation of electrofunk releases on said label for a while.

On the whole, though, you're right. Drugs have not been a big part of the history of techno in Detroit, but I'd never rule out the possibility that they get used.

All that said:

has anyone heard jeff mills live in tokyo (possibly the liquid room i cant remember) i think he must of snorted 50 bags of coke then shoved biros in his ears just befoer he went on cos im buggerd if i can find on mix that stays in sync more than 10 seconds.

i mean i can understand this happening a few times in anight, but every bloody track, and then to have the cheek to release it as a cd. Plus as far as i can tell the whole thing was recorded through a mic so the sound quality is pants, i sent it back

I can say with confidence that the Liquid Rooms mix is the best commercially released techno mix CD I've ever heard (and I've heard a lot, once was a time when 2 or 3 of the f.uckers would land on the doormat every week)...in fact the only one I've heard that isn't so awfully dull that it ever got more than one listen. Again, it's a simple case of "if you weren't there...". I feel sorry for the people who criticise such meaningless aspects as the mixing...because they'll never know just how it felt to be in the throng in the middle of a Mills set at that time. Believe me mate, there was not one person there who was standing there thinking "hmmm, that wasn't beat matched very well", cos they were too busy having their head f.ucked with. A track would come slamming in, in time, out of time, in my lady's chamber...didn't matter, the crowd would go wild cos everyone knew it meant we going further, up a level.

There I go again, getting all misty eyed.

[crime]

People are worth what someone is prepared to pay them....

As much as I'm pretty indifferent to what mills does these days, he was a Pioneer in his day...
Personally, I'm getting to the point where I think the fact that "techno" has become so Genreised and typecast, that it's hard to provide any innovation that is acceptable to the majority of people that consider themselves to be into techno... Seems to me like the majority of people into this kind of music have already made up their minds what they like and what they don't like, and arn't as open minded as they like to think... this is why we'll never see anyone quite like Mills or Vogel again in techno.. I think we may well see a resergence in popularity in the music, but there will never be that feeling of the "Cutting edge" like we had back in 94/95/96.... So long as people are enjoying it though, that's the main thing...

But it's for this reason people like mills command such high fees, is because they were there, at the forefront of it, when it was most popular....

People might say the liquid rooms mix was ropey, personally, I LIKED the ropeyness of it, it just oozed pure energy and excitement... and if you actually listened closely to what he was doing, it was really inspirational... I mean the first few trax, 2 copies of the extremist into manganeze, spinback spot on timed for the break, you have to be on the ball.... Ok it may sound ropey now, but bear in mind it came out in '95, before the loop overkill, and it sounded really fresh... back in 94/95 it was harder to find Loop techno, there wasn't much of it about, so it wasn't like a whole load of tunes you'd heard a million times before....

Like I say though, I wouldn't go rushing out to see mills now.. like someone said earlier, you had to be there.....

[Patrick]

... Seems to me like the majority of people into this kind of music have already made up their minds what they like and what they don't like, and arn't as open minded as they like to think...

Spot on, Mark. And therein lies the problem. That in a nutshell is why there are so many of these endlessly boring arguments on forums. To me it's so simple. **** all the genres, there are just two types of techno, in fact two types of music cos I don't limit my listening to just techno : Good and bad. Seems obvious and easy, but you'd be surprised how many people miss it. :roll:

[crime]

And to add, I think there's a lot to be said about quitting while you're ahead...

to quote the man himself "Every dog has its day"... maybe he was trying to be ironic when he named the records like that.. everything I've heard of late sounds to me like a second rate rehash of himself, well, the purposemaker stuff anyway...

Axis 11 was an inspiration to me, nothing else after that seemed as good... maybe "The Bells" suffered just by being played too much...

[death on a stick]

Agreed. Although I love the EDHID stuff, it does all sound very similar and one or maybe two volumes would have sufficed. 4 so far, and I can't tell the difference.

I think up to the "Other day" and "Tomorrow" EPs he was on the ball. After those he's not really hit the spot for me.

Still, his sets at the last Lost and also at Sonar were both very different from eachother, and both very good. Compared to other DJs playing, that is.

[crime]

I suppose that kind of music dosn't really appeal to me any more, especially after hearing a lot of people imitating him very badly for the past 6 years... I have got the impression he sounds better when he plays abroad than when he plays here though...

[ampassasinbirmingham]

I was only asking if you lot saw an ickle film :roll:

[death on a stick]

It's quite a big film. I think the full version is 3 or 4 hours long, innit?

Yeah, I meant to mention that I was amazed that a thread on a film ended up as somewhere for the overtly ignorant to diss things they obviously didn't understand.

At least I mentioned the film in my first post!

[Patrick]

I was only asking if you lot saw an ickle film :roll:

Well, you know us Amp. Any chance for a ruck, especuially about Millsy ! :P :lol: :lol:

Actually I did type a post earlier about the film, and I lost the fcking thing before I got a chance to hit Submit and I can't be arsed retyping it. Maybe later.

[crime]

I was only asking if you lot saw an ickle film :roll:

sorry, turned in to the digression session... Seen snippets of the film but never with the Mills Soundtrack...

[davethedrummer]

must admit i'd love to write music for a film
i'd really like to see what jeff mills did with metropolis
its a silent movie originally innit?
i wonder if there's some way of putting the 2 together and burning it???
hmmm
anybody??

[The Divide]

I am 21 and a lot of people my age (and younger) who slag Mills off. I find realy sad and arrogant. What have they done for the Techno scene apart from go out and buy records?? Althougth...

How come such a high class Producer/D.J has trouble keeping the mxing tight?? I if it wasnt for that I think the more younger generation would appreciate what he does more. I think hes genius when it comes to production. He has his own sound and thats hard to find these days.

[crime]

I am 21 and a lot of people my age (and younger) who slag Mills off. I find realy sad and arrogant. What have they done for the Techno scene apart from go out and buy records?? Althougth...

How come such a high class Producer/D.J has trouble keeping the mxing tight?? I if it wasnt for that I think the more younger generation would appreciate what he does more. I think hes genius when it comes to production. He has his own sound and thats hard to find these days.

Bear in mind the amount of records he mixes in 1 hour and the fact he's playing on 3 decks.... seriously, try and play like he does on that liquid rooms mix... bear in mind a lot of the time he'll be playing 2 copies of almost every record (Because he's playing on 3 decks) and you'll see what I mean... I know what you mean, it can sound sloppy, but perfect beat matching every time is not what makes a good dj.... It's about style and character... Technical ability is cool, but there's nothing more boring than hearing one perfect but boring mix after another....

[BritishMurderBoy]

must admit i'd love to write music for a film
i'd really like to see what jeff mills did with metropolis
its a silent movie originally innit?
i wonder if there's some way of putting the 2 together and burning it???
hmmm
anybody??

the version i have is apparently as close to the original is as commercially available: there is sections were the film has been edited with new parts filling in those that were lost when Fritz Lang (the director) fled germany in the lates 20's.. Apparently Lang left germany were he was asked by hitler and goebals to do short for films for the nazi party..

its about 2 hrs and 45 minutes: its definatley worth a watch.. when we did a mate of ours was spinning some records so we got to avoid the original 20's german score :roll:

me and amp have often thought it would be nice to make a short film and have some music made to accompany...

[BritishMurderBoy]

just to note one of the amazing things about the film is how ahead of its time it obviously is: the suits the men where and the depiction of and urban landscape is all very convincing... it a definate cult film and i have noticed films since watching it they have clearly played homage to the directors work.. blade runner inparticular..

[The Divide]

Bear in mind the amount of records he mixes in 1 hour and the fact he's playing on 3 decks.... seriously, try and play like he does on that liquid rooms mix... bear in mind a lot of the time he'll be playing 2 copies of almost every record (Because he's playing on 3 decks) and you'll see what I mean... I know what you mean, it can sound sloppy, but perfect beat matching every time is not what makes a good dj.... It's about style and character... Technical ability is cool, but there's nothing more boring than hearing one perfect but boring mix after another....

Yeah i agree.

I wonder if there's anywhere online where I can metropolis

[BritishMurderBoy]

do you mean buy it or download?