logic 6 versus cubase SX

[tekara]

sorry to bring this up guys becauise im sure this topic has been raped beyond belief, but i want to know from techno producers point of view:

okay i have a Power Mac G4 1.25ghz, 1GB of Ram

Im wondering if it would be better to get Logic 6 now that Apple has bought out Emagic and will probably offer better OS X support, or should i go with the Cubase for its ease of use?

i understand logic has a steeper learning curve and is less user friendly, but has nicer graphic interface. Somebody also told me that Logic is a complete memory and processor hog, is that true?

im thinking of getting logic, but if i buy Cubase SX, the guy told me he would also throw in NI Kontakt for free...is this worth the trade off?

interested in hearing your opinions.

cheers

[djTequila]

Having used Logic 5 and Cubase SX on a PC, I can tell you that, after learning to use it, Logic proved to be the more creative and adaptable system. This puts me is an awkward situation, but that's my problem!

Forget how 'nice' the interface looks, think about what you need. Logic is geared slightly more towards a hardware setup, and SX slightly is more soft synth/plugin friendly. This might be different on the mac... And will change over time.

Logic comes with EXS24, which will do you in place of Kontakt. It also has much more professional sounding effects included in the package, the EQs are better, and the included synths are very sweet-sounding. The synths in Cubase are OK, but I personally prefer the Logic ones. (I'm talking about the Platinum edition here). Even the simple ones just scream quality.

You WILL have a steep learning curve learning Logic, if that's the way you go. However, I'm here if you need some starting points. And once you get the hang of it, it's gorgeous...

Another thing to think about is the fact that Apple should now be working very closely with Emagic, in order to optimise Logic for their platform. This means that you're buying into a line which should improve for your machine faster than all the competition. Thus any memory/processor issues will be ironed out pretty quickly.

Ask yourself, also, why you're being offered a 'sweetener' to buy Cubase...?

If I had a Mac, there'd be no question which sequencer I'd invest in.

T*

[interferron]

good ol' cubase vs logic discussion pops up in every production oriented forum at least four times a year .. after let's say about ten messages people usually begin using good arguments like "true, but then again your mom is a ****" and the standard reply to that goes "no no you got it all wrong, YOUR mom is a ****" :)

i prefer logic (audio platinum), having used it for years.. and one of the reasons:

Logic is geared slightly more towards a hardware setup, and SX slightly is more soft synth/plugin friendly.

...is my hardware oriented setup. logic's "environment" is truly something unique and a very flexible system once you learn to use it (may take a while). for those that don't know: you get to set up your production environment as objects like "roland jv-1080", "filter box", "audio channel 5" etc. all the MIDI is routed through this environment and you can do the "virtual cabling" as you wish. it includes functional helpers like sliders, transforming events as you like, arpeggiators. all this affects your whole logic environment so each window shows your equipment in the order and detail you want and need.

someone has built a fully functioning 16-step sequencer in the style of the TR-909 with logic's environment, which should tell us something about the systems flexibility and power :) i use it for programming things like MIDI-CC routing from my Oxygen8's knobs to control different audio channels at realtime for the dubmix-style, and more interesting tricks like launching sysex-messages from MIDI-notes to change an external FM-synth's operator algorithms on the fly etc..

all very interesting, yes i'm getting excited now... ;)

You WILL have a steep learning curve learning Logic, if that's the way you go.

yeah not the easiest of systems to learn.. after using it for years i bought a book about it which i found very useful (i can check the name if anyone's interested). learned a lot of small tricks and about the process which the writer was using himself. if anyone would start using logic now, i'd definitely recommend buying a good book, a weeks supply of food, drink and good shit to smoke, turn off your phone and take a week's intensive course in it. it'll be worth it.

[djTequila]

Making Music with Emagic Logic Audio by Stephen Bennett is good.

The environment isn't just good for MIDI. I've found audio flexibility in there that's second only to Reason's model. And I've heard 6 is even better.

You can use any track as a side chain on VST compressors and gates as well... Something I really missed with Cubase.

T*

[tekara]

thanks for the advice guys, i'll definately look into something like logic 6.

Im just scared the learning curve is gonna be ridiculous since i suck at technology...how ironic i listen to techno.

It is still possible to do everything that logic does in cubase though right?

<downloading both demos now>

cheers

[interferron]

It is still possible to do everything that logic does in cubase though right?

yeah, both of these are professional tools and there's not much you can't do to audio and midi with them. most of the functions are exactly same, some only differ in naming and of course there's a couple of tricks of their own in both.

[tekara]

according to the emagic website:

"Plug-Ins and Audio-Instruments


Up to 64 Audio Instruments for insertion of Emagic, Audio Unit (Mac OS X) and VST2 (Mac OS 9) virtual instruments"

does this mean that in Logic, i will not be able to use things like Native Instruments soft synths and samplers along with Logic? Because it says VST2 is Mac Os9 compatible only and i am running on OSX.

Also i am probably going to be building on a software based studio, with the occasional hardware synth, but i probably wont be plugging in a million hardware modules.

Will this also effect my decision?

thanks!

[djTequila]

I've heard of the troubles with OSX... Seems like Apple jumped a bit too far ahead on that one, and left a fair few people behind. All the advice I heard was 'Stick with 9 for now and swap to 10 when all the problems are ironed out.'

Not much help here...

Contact the suppliers of the soft synths you wish to use, and see if they produce plugins that are compatible. If they don't, ask them when the products are likely to appear. All the major companies will cater for OSX, but there may be a wait while they all catch up.

Also, I *think* I've read about a 'wrapper' program which will allow you to use all those VSTs in Logic on OSX. I'll see if I can hunt down the article tonight and find out if it's appropriate.

Is there the same problem with Cubase on OSX?

T*

[tekara]

thanks for the info tequila,

i think what you were referring to is called the Audio wrapper that is supposed to make VSTi compatible with Logic 6, but ive heard of numerous problems when them together...

who knows, instead of just blindly jumping into this and buying a software i may regret later, i may hold back and do a bit more research on the two to see what i find is more convenient for my setup.

thanks for all the help guys!

[djTequila]

Very good plan.

[compuphonic]

I've owned Logic 6 and SX for Mac. I prefer working with Logic, despite having been a Cubase user for 10 years. It probably took me a year of average hobby use to get competent in Logic, but I feel it was worth it.
The only thing I miss is the Phrase Synth from Cubase..

Since SX2 has just been announced it might be a good idea to wait and see how the features compare.

[MARKEG]

sx and osx work fine for me. but the screen redraw are a prob on my g4 laptop.

mind you i'm just about to buy logic 6 for osx - will keep you informed.

[DJZeMig_L]

Mark .. on the subject of screen redraws... did u ever installed that extra ram?? does it still happen after that..

there was previous talk about sx 1.0.6 being really buggy... I must say that I have SL 1.0.6 at the shop and haven't had any real bugs... mind U it's an original prog.

I think the only real advantage of Logic might b it's outstanding native plug ins... I guess cubase eq./ comp could b better and a basic hallion wouldn't b 2 much 2 ask!

Seems SX 2 will have some really cool features .. like proper routing (finally We might b able 2 key insert into compressors) and channel freeze ;)

Z

[Jimfish]

When is SX2 out then ZM?

[djTequila]

The only thing I miss is the Phrase Synth from Cubase..

What's that then? I'm guessing it's nothing to do with X-Phrase?

T*

[compuphonic]

The interactive phrase synth or IPS, its been there since the Atari days, it lets you take midi patterns and loop them while modulating them by all sorts of differnt sources or triggers to create new ideas..

Its actually the sort of thing that could be knocked up in the Logic environment, I just haven't quit got that advanced yet..

Which is one of the reasons I chose Logic, I found I could customise it to my work habits far better than the Steinberg products.

The Logic Environment concept really does let you lift the lid on the inner workings of the audio/midi data and chew it and route it as you want

[DJZeMig_L]

Normally SX 2 would b out by sept. 4th.. 3days away...

check it out...

http://www.steinberg.net/en/ps/start/?sid=0


Most Midi... IPS is quite mind bending but U can do some really crazy stuff with it ...

Z

[Jimfish]

WOW!!!! :D :D :D
this is like christmas!!!!