Mark Williams

**The Overfiend** · 20-09-2003, 11:46 PM

I am latin and I swear half of the people don't know the stuff they are sampling. It's pathetic.

**Sunil** · 20-09-2003, 11:51 PM

Originally Posted by MARK EG

yeah it seems to me like he's using this tribal thing all the time. i don't get it. he's obviously such a talented producer :(

yeah it is a bit puzzling alright, Ben Sims was the man for that sound, and now there's all these other producers (Paul Mac,Williams, Broom) doing the exact same or as close as on Ingoma. It's a complete waste of their services, if they are gonna continue releasing on Sims' labels they should be given a crack at doing a Theory or a Symbolism and try something different, can't understand (Besides the financial gain) why Sims doesn't wake up and smell the ****in coffee!!

**Sam_Horam** · 21-09-2003, 02:37 AM

I'm too pissed right now to make a reasoned post...

BUT

a lot of this thread is so hypocritical and I'll argue my point a bit later...

Cheers lads...

Back to the argument soon...

**Sam_Horam** · 21-09-2003, 02:39 AM

BTW to my friends across the Atlantic -

"pissed" means inebriated NOT in a bad mood

;)

**Adverse** · 21-09-2003, 06:13 AM

:) saaaaam... hope you had a good one hehehehe

**herman** · 25-09-2003, 12:45 PM

Originally Posted by Sunil

Originally Posted by MARK EG

yeah it seems to me like he's using this tribal thing all the time. i don't get it. he's obviously such a talented producer :(

yeah it is a bit puzzling alright, Ben Sims was the man for that sound, and now there's all these other producers (Paul Mac,Williams, Broom) doing the exact same or as close as on Ingoma. It's a complete waste of their services, if they are gonna continue releasing on Sims' labels they should be given a crack at doing a Theory or a Symbolism and try something different, can't understand (Besides the financial gain) why Sims doesn't wake up and smell the **** coffee!!

Im really not sure what you guys are driving at here i mean surely the tribal sound is a perfectly valid sound in its own right ?

**Jimfish** · 25-09-2003, 12:57 PM

its not nearly as samey as the hard stuff IMO

**Angrymann** · 25-09-2003, 12:59 PM

This is an old argument brought up again. I spoke my mind about the tribal thing a while back and someone from Ingoma got back to me but never really said that much. It's easy to criticise when you aren't actually producing (like myself) but I did put forward my reasons for criticising the label.

1: The tracks are all too similar sounding . The answer I got for that was that it was because it was a "tribal label" , which isn't really an explanation , just cause it's tribal doesn't mean it has to sound exactly the same.

2: The tracks are released far too often. It's only my opinion but I don't think good techno can be churned out at a rate of two or three releases a month and still keep the sound fresh or maintain a high quality.

3: I have to pay for my records , so if I am paying between 5 and 8 quid for a record , I expect it to be different from the previous release enough for me to justify the money I pay for it . I don't think you can say that about the Ingoma label.

I am not direspecting Ben Sims or any of the other producer/remixers on this label as a lot of them I would list as my favourite producers. I just feel that the label is relying on a tried and tested sound and is not going anywhere new. It's very much in danger of going the "Samuel L Sessions" way.

**Jimfish** · 25-09-2003, 01:08 PM

i mean, all the hard techno producers just seem to stick to that one sound, and none of you say anything about that..
I cant think of any hard techno producers that ever vary thier sound - its allways the same kinda hard techno - so if that is acceptable, why isnt the tribal sound?

I know what you mean about the way a lot of tribal tunes sound the same as do a few of marks, but if you listen to his work across the board i guarantee you will find 100% more variation than say, glenn wilsons sound.

You guys have to remember a lot of the tribal guys have been at it for years and thier sounds have elvolved through many individual styles. Mark has released all kinds of stuff in his time.. breakbeat, progressive, minimal techno, downbeat etc etc. Tribal is just where he is at now - but his sound is evolving forward i promise you.

**Adverse** · 25-09-2003, 05:05 PM

Originally Posted by Jimfish

i mean, all the hard techno producers just seem to stick to that one sound, and none of you say anything about that..
I cant think of any hard techno producers that ever vary thier sound - its allways the same kinda hard techno - so if that is acceptable, why isnt the tribal sound?

i couldn't agree more..

**Sam_Horam** · 25-09-2003, 06:50 PM

The board's working again... :lol:

Just to return to what I was saying when I was wrecked, seems like Jim and Adverse have already said what I was trying to say...

I really love a lot of the stuff in this style...it seems some people on this thread have a problem with the sound - end of story... and that's fair enough, but I think you can say the same about all styles at various times...

I'm not really into a lot of the harder stuff that a lot of you guys on this board dig... and a lot of that sounds the same to me... but only 'cos I don't really listen to it that closely and don't spend time finding the really good stuff...

And just taking Ingoma... I think it's a great label... some great records on there... sure there's been a lot released in a short time... but to suggest that they're just churning them out is wrong if you ask me... do you honestly believe it's for the money (as someone on this thread said) or because that's what they wanted to write?

**miles** · 25-09-2003, 10:21 PM

Originally Posted by herman

Originally Posted by Sunil

Originally Posted by MARK EG

yeah it seems to me like he's using this tribal thing all the time. i don't get it. he's obviously such a talented producer :(

yeah it is a bit puzzling alright, Ben Sims was the man for that sound, and now there's all these other producers (Paul Mac,Williams, Broom) doing the exact same or as close as on Ingoma. It's a complete waste of their services, if they are gonna continue releasing on Sims' labels they should be given a crack at doing a Theory or a Symbolism and try something different, can't understand (Besides the financial gain) why Sims doesn't wake up and smell the **** coffee!!

Im really not sure what you guys are driving at here i mean surely the tribal sound is a perfectly valid sound in its own right ?

Come on Herman, it aint exactly a new sound.
The New York boys have been caning it for years, you have probaly got and
sampled most of the releases along with ben sims!

**The Overfiend** · 25-09-2003, 11:40 PM

Come on Herman, it aint exactly a new sound.
The New York boys have been caning it for years, you have probaly got and
sampled most of the releases along with ben sims![/quote]

true story miles!

I think people are realizing that sampling the latin thing is played. I grew up with half of the songs people sampled and it's funny to see Yo fellas boriqua sampled and nobody has even been to puerto rico. If things are going towards a non sample based creative platform I say amen to that because thats what techno is. expression of feelings thru music and sounds YOU created not time tested rhythms that have had people jumpin since the 40's an 50's.

**Jimfish** · 25-09-2003, 11:54 PM

there is more to the uk tribal sound than a few latin vocals boys

**The Overfiend** · 25-09-2003, 11:59 PM

I agree, But I am talking about the Sims sound
Not the Uk Surgeonesque Ruskin Breakbeat sound, thats king right there
Didnt mean to be misconstrued. :lol:

**Jimfish** · 26-09-2003, 12:06 AM

dude, i aint no big fan of sims tunes, but far less of his work than you obviously think actually has those tribal vocals in it.

**The Overfiend** · 26-09-2003, 12:09 AM

Dude I know I just didn't feel like going into detail to every f*ck who uses the vocals. I would just like to hear a stomper from him once in a blue with no congas whatsoever. I mean a real good hard f*ck!

**Jimfish** · 26-09-2003, 12:20 AM

fair do's but the flipside to that is that i allways want to hear all the harder boys do somthing with a bit more funk..

you stay in that little box over there and keep listening to your stuff , and i'll lock myself in this wee box here and listen to mine, howzat sound?

**** it, haha, i dont even really like tribal stuff that much - but i have respect for the way it works on the turntabels and its great fun for the people that choose that kind of mixing. :)

kinda on this subject, what producer vary between... **** it, ill start a new thread 4 this one.. :lol:

sorry, bit bambooozled tonite :)

**The Overfiend** · 26-09-2003, 12:31 AM

To answer you're question Skoog, Bicknell. Bacto.

**Jimfish** · 26-09-2003, 12:43 AM

yep yep yep.. staffan is good at this too...

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