New to producing techno - pls give me advice

[Sunil]

Got to start somewhere. Nobody really starts out creating innovative, original work.

Best starting off by getting to grips with people you rate, understanding how they have put tracks together and why, and then going off and doing your own thing once you have mastered the sound a little bit more.

Yeah, it takes time to make killer tracks - but I have never heard it said that you should copy your favourite producer first, and then find your own route?? It's inevitable that any of us that produce will be in some way influenced by our favourite producers, but to go in and step-by-step COPY someone else's work is a terrible way to start, and to be honest is pretty extraordinary advice for you to be giving someone here. Ok, so maybe you or the majority of techno producers operate this way, but it's a pretty sad way to go about things in my opinion and highlights a lack of ambition and desire to experiment.

You're basically giving this guy the advice to be a sheep for a year or two, and then to start being himself? Yeah, really good reasoning in that - probably the biggest load of bullony I've read here in a while I'm sorry to say.

[eyeswithoutaface]

it's actually half good, half bad advice. I dont think he means literaly copy their sounds, their riffs etc etc, but studying certain artists sequencing or tracking down will do a person wonders who is just starting out, as getting whole tracks down and laid out in a comprehendable sequence can be the real pit fall for alot of new people starting out. It certainly was for me, but being a DJ anyway helped me overcome that quickly.

learning how to effectively build up a track to a break, and work a breakdown, is incredibly difficult starting out. You listen to people like Speedy J and i tell thee he did not start doing those massive, intense breakdowns the first time he ever opened a sequencer and a synth.

Dont copy a persons sound no. Thats a massive no no, but there is absolutley nothing wrong with studying other producers actual techniques and applying them to your own learning. More often than not this is when people can spot differences in the techniques and start to build their own way of working.

but yeah i think it was worded a little wrong maybe ;)

[Jay Pace]

Yeah, it takes time to make killer tracks - but I have never heard it said that you should copy your favourite producer first, and then find your own route.....

You're basically giving this guy the advice to be a sheep for a year or two, and then to start being himself? Yeah, really good reasoning in that - probably the biggest load of bullony I've read here in a while I'm sorry to say.

Eh? Thats not what I said at all. Don't put words in my mouth man...

I recommended listening to people very carefully and figure out how they did what they did, as it one of the best ways to learn. Learn by example.

Pretty basic advice really.

[Sunil]

Eh? Thats not what I said at all. Don't put words in my mouth man...

I recommended listening to people very carefully and figure out how they did what they did, as it one of the best ways to learn. Learn by example.

Pretty basic advice really.

Nah, it is effectively what you were saying. You probably don't realise it yourself at this stage, if that's your approach to production, but your advice does amount to what I said above.

You said , very clearly, to listen to other people's tracks and *copy them*. From *their* drum programming, to *their* track structure, to *their* sounds.

Y'know this probably is good advice in some ways, but not the kind of advice anyone who wants to stand out or make original music, should be taking.

[loopdon]

Nah, it is effectively what you were saying. You probably don't realise it yourself at this stage, if that's your approach to production, but your advice does amount to what I said above.

You said , very clearly, to listen to other people's tracks and *copy them*. From *their* drum programming, to *their* track structure, to *their* sounds.

Y'know this probably is good advice in some ways, but not the kind of advice anyone who wants to stand out or make original music, should be taking.

I really don't know what stage you think Jay is at? I mean we could talk about personal taste all day but his productions are quality. Imo. An i am sure many will agree.

Regarding the 'copying' issue. It's tried and tested and people have been successfully doing so forever. And not only in music. Learn the rules before you break them etc. I will stop here.

[Sunil]

I really don't know what stage you think Jay is at? I mean we could talk about personal taste all day but his productions are quality. Imo. An i am sure many will agree.
.

I'm not questioning the quality of his music or production level, I just didn't agree with the advice.

[danielmarshall]

Why nitpick semantics Sunil. He clarified what he said, and then you bitch on about it. ****, some people..

[Sunil]

Why nitpick semantics Sunil. He clarified what he said, and then you bitch on about it. ****, some people..

From what I read in your previous post it wasn't like you were in 100% agreement either. I had my point of view and made it pretty clearly I thought. In hindsight, I acknowledged that I may have zoned in too much on certain bits of what Jay said. It wasn't like my comments have been very warmly received here, Jay didn't like what I said, and you're the second person jumping in to defend him, when it's pretty apparant that he can do that himself already. ****, some people ;)

[Jay Pace]

FFS

I didn't say anything about copying step by step, or being a sheep.

Listen to people you like very carefully then copy them
Best way to learn, about drum programming, track structure, the sounds used etc etc

Pls note the best way to learn ABOUT part

If you are new to producing techno (NB the title of the thread), and you particularly like one style - detroit, acid, minimal etc its important to understand how the tracks are put together.

This is what was actually asked in the first place:

I'd be really grateful if any one can give me some tps on producing techno. I know it is fairly experimental but is there any framework e.g. emphasis on kicks, hats, structure (always 4/4), tempo etc.

This is why I suggested maybe taking the time to desconstruct what other people are doing. Deconstructing other people's work gives you the skills and knowledge how to build your own.

You probably don't realise it yourself at this stage, if that's your approach to production

Thats a ****ing arrogant statement.

This is a production forum where people come to learn and share.
You're doing neither.

[Sunil]

I didn't say anything about copying step by step, or being a sheep.

Ok, well it seemed to amount to the same thing.

Thats a ****ing arrogant statement.

This is a production forum where people come to learn and share.
You're doing neither.

I'm not being arrogant by saying that (maybe it was a bit strong though), but your methods aren't the ones many other producers would choose or would want to choose. That said, I do see the merits of what you are saying in some ways, just seems a very plaguristic and unexciting approach in my opinion - maybe it works for some people though?

I have to say from experience, that the people I have known who have tried to take this route i.e. Making a Vitalic style tune, or a Plastikman tune or whatever, have been those that ended up sounding very unexciting.

Perhaps I should have given some advice, but I got sidetracked!