RIP Acid Techno?

[Athar]

Acid Techno never die Si because still a lot heads lovin it.
Acid Techno its not only sub genre of techno music, its a massive subculture. Thats why it will be exist in our minds.
But i must agreed, acid techno lost somewhere their old school atmosphere, but there is second side of medal - we are going (i mean producers) somewhere where we never been before. Its a normal evolution. It makes this music still creative, its not boring and its a door for next generations.

i think its time for the new wave of acid techno (pardon the pun) producers to step up to the controls and have their input....mutuate to survive (to coin a phraze (henrys right!))

Couldnt say better than paul here. Thats a way!!!!

[Si the Sigh]

Oh, I agree with the mutate and evolve to survive thing. Please don't get me wrong. But during a time when sales are low, why not turn to how the sound was in its peak? Like everyone keeps banging on about in thye techno forum with the minimal issue.

[lunatrick]

that hads it's time and place......a good place admittedly, but you can't recreate spontaneous events..........we're all getting older - how many young kids in techno will remember and spout on about current tunes which in their minds will be seminal and crucial? Si mutate into the future and produce the sound which you obviously think is missing from the scene, and bring on the new wave!

[dirty_bass]

I see ot like this.
And don`t all you acid heads jump on me, Acid is my roots in temrs of techno.
It got me into techno, it got me into squat parties, and in fact I ended up putting on very large illegal acid techno raves myself in london because of it, as one of the soundsystems in United Systems (ahhh the good old days).
So I don`t hate it.

All good music is born out of passion and a wave of energy and emotion.
The early years of acid techno, all the guys were riding their wave, it was fresh, it was it`s own sound, and they were the kings of it.

Now 10 years down the road, do you really expect them to be able to make the same music with the same passion?
They gotta move on, if they had that creative and original spark in the first place then they will naturally move on and explore.

I think Henry`s new stuff is great, it`s not acid techno, but it`s great, and it`s his thing, and still spawns many imitators.
Same with Julian etc.

However, the acid labels have a legacy and need to stay within that niche in this market, so the acid releases especially on SUF seemed to get more and more derivative, and lacking passion, bar the odd cheeky comedy tune.

In a way, it looks to me, to keep sales up, elements of hard house and hard dance started getting absorbed.
So it was no longer it`s own thing. It wasn`t acid techno, it was a little brother of hard dance.

I think acid techno at it`s best was pretty stripped down music, with or without 303`s it tended to be reasonably minimal, but still very hard.

I don`t think Acid techno is dead, I think the creators have moved on, and find it difficult to inject passion into it when they do do it.
However, money and status probably comes into it too, people need to pay the rent etc.

I think some new bloody is needed.
At the mo, the only fresh talent I see on the labels is made by people who are mimicking their heroes anyway, so it still sounds derivative and hard dancey Maybe again this is a play safe option, I don`t know.

There`s got to be some messed up, twisted and disturbing producers out there making fresh acid techno.
The music used to be so disturbing at times, frenetic without being cheesy or predictable, it was a head**** unto itself without the aid of drugs.
Early route releases were just evil. Mushrooms on daleks etc, there was a definite psychadelic edge too, which seems to have vanished.
There was also a stark emotional beauty sometimes, look at Ice, by Carbine.
Cluster had it`s own, really messed up version of techno, which now seems to have blended in with the harder end of techno in general.
It no longer stands apart.

There must be a talent pool out there.
Dammit, they should be sending their stuff to SUF HQ.

the only person I`ve encountered on my travels who comes close to capturing the old spirit of acid techno, without being a rip off artist, is Paul Cortex.

I know the guy, and you pretty much can`t find anyone more into the spirit of that music than him.
If you see his name on a roster, and you like acid techno I seriously suggest you go see his live Pa.

Acid isn`t dead, it`s resting for a bit, waiting for the next generation of kids to get sicked with the emo fed clubscene, and the tightening laws against fun.

I`m sure their will be a new generation of free partis some time within the next few years to fual it.

[rhythmtech]

@ dirtybass

im sorry but thats toss.

there are plenty of producers new & old doing the acid thing and doing it very well. the "oldschool" producers might not be as inventive as they were at one stage but they still come up with some classics now and again..

just look at route 59, suf 87, suf 84, suf 82 (to name but a few) & tunes like DTD's "hotwire" on infectious clearly show that acid CAN cross over into differant genres and still be outstanding.

to say that theres only 1 (new) producer doing it well is a serious insult to the likes of dogwash, KN, rhythm logistics, AP, myself or anyone else that is doing their thing (im not taking anything away from paul - he does it very well & is definitly up there).

but as with everything else the public vote with their feet and they're still voting acid..

[dirty_bass]

@ dirtybass

im sorry but thats toss.

there are plenty of producers new & old doing the acid thing and doing it very well. the "oldschool" producers might not be as inventive as they were at one stage but they still come up with some classics now and again..

just look at route 59, suf 87, suf 84, suf 82 (to name but a few) & tunes like DTD's "hotwire" on infectious clearly show that acid CAN cross over into differant genres and still be outstanding.

to say that theres only 1 (new) producer doing it well is a serious insult to the likes of dogwash, KN, rhythm logistics, AP, myself or anyone else that is doing their thing (im not taking anything away from paul - he does it very well & is definitly up there).

but as with everything else the public vote with their feet and they're still voting acid..

Toss to you, truth to me.

I don`t see anyone making good acid techno.
Just my opinion.

There`s some good techno on some of those labels, but it isn`t acid.

[rhythmtech]

Toss to you, truth to me.

I don`t see anyone making good acid techno.
Just my opinion.

There`s some good techno on some of those labels, but it isn`t acid.

exactly.. its just your opinion. and considering you seem to have the same opinion about most techno then y not just give it a rest?

for years the acid scene has endured bad attitude from techno "purists" and "elitists" (elitists is your own description of yourself in another thread remember). but having been involved in this perticular scene, you surely should know that the purist and elitist opinion isnt worth a toss.

[tocsin]

Oh, I agree with the mutate and evolve to survive thing. Please don't get me wrong. But during a time when sales are low, why not turn to how the sound was in its peak? Like everyone keeps banging on about in thye techno forum with the minimal issue.

Maybe I'm different in opinion than most, but unless you are absolutely fine with fading into obscurity while you do something so different in an effort to do something new, I just don't understand why artists don't do exactly what you describe above, while varying on it slightly, unless they have lost the plot. I'd love to hear some of that 96 tranced out hard acid sound come back again and it has absolutely nothing to do with any nostalgia or memories from the time. Rather, it was just a sound that grabbed me more than most others I've heard.

[Si the Sigh]

Maybe I'm different in opinion than most, but unless you are absolutely fine with fading into obscurity while you do something so different in an effort to do something new, I just don't understand why artists don't do exactly what you describe above, while varying on it slightly, unless they have lost the plot. I'd love to hear some of that 96 tranced out hard acid sound come back again and it has absolutely nothing to do with any nostalgia or memories from the time. Rather, it was just a sound that grabbed me more than most others I've heard.

Thank you! Some one else gets where I'm coming from. :)

Also, whats happened to the labels within the SUF Collectives output? They all used to supply a certain sound, ie; acid trance & acid techno (SUF) techno (Cluster for example), and tech house (Yolk for example).

The labels were started to put out a certain type of sound.

Now you've got the same sounds coming out on all the labels, and new producers supplying nothing new, too many clone sounds. The labels are loosing their identity, and IMO the sound of London acid techno is getting lost.

It's time to go back to the roots and save the sound.

If techno going minimal is it's restart of it gaining popularity, then acid techno needs to do the same.

Acid techno needs to get back to basics.

"Back to the basic element...back"

Damn, I need to get into the studio soon...

Maybe I'd stop moaning then! :)

[Si the Sigh]

Now you've got the same sounds coming out on all the labels, and new producers supplying nothing new, too many clone sounds. The labels are loosing their identity, and IMO the sound of London acid techno is getting lost.

Thats not a diss towards the new producers on the scene by the way, but I don't hear anything fresh coming from them.

[rhythmtech]

Thats not a diss towards the new producers on the scene by the way, but I don't hear anything fresh coming from them.

to be honest si i think thats mostly to do with the collective having an idea what sound they want themselves.

if you look at new producers when they release on labels not involved with the collective its a differant story. ie android.. his other stuff is totally differant from his powertools/cluster stuff.

from my own side of things, damaged trax is nothing like the collective stuff i hope, i dont mean that as a diss to suf but i want to carve my own sound. but for the stuff i've done for suf i needed to supply them with a perticular style. if i'm asked for a stayupforever tune then theres no real point in giving them funky techno.

but i do see your point on labels like yolk. i think yolk, although still releasing some great tracks, has lost its vision a little BUT on the other hand its chris's label so possibly chris's vision for the label has changed?

[tocsin]

Damn, I need to get into the studio soon...
Maybe I'd stop moaning then! :)

Word. What do you use for production now? Feel like doing a net collab? I'd love to work on some 96 style acid and tweak it. :)

[Si the Sigh]

At the moment, my head! :)

My PC's at my mates getting sorted out after a few problems. Well, it's been there for about 3 - 4 months. Really need to ring him later...

Once I'm back up and running though I wanna get straight back on it, get these tracks out of my head!

[Little_Fella!]

I just wanted to pick up on Si The Sigh's point regarding identity and the hard dance scene....

I came from a Hard House/Hard Trance background then found Acid Techno properly once I moved to London..

At first I thought, "What a great combination the two would make..". This was naive as became clear when it happened...

Now, I remember when Dave The Drummer did a remix of Energy Flash on Nkleuz B-side which I duly bought... at the time I was only buying nothing but Acid & Techno so the A-side BK thing did nothing for me but I was so pleased because the B-side held it's own - it was Dave The Drummer making his style of Techno cohesive to the scene that he and the S.U.F. collective had created...

Fine and dandy... But uh oh... those producers and D.J.'s had found something that made all the difference when it came to needing to play something that didn't have an off beat bassline synonymous to Hard House...

[Little_Fella!]

This added a new dimension to there sets... Gave there prowess' a much needed boosting.. The likes of Lisa Pin-Up, pretty thing that she is, jumpin up n down raisin' the crowd a bit more, improving the mood as her set entered it's last hour....

What was she playing? Tunes with the familiar Acid techno bassline that was used in the late eighties Chicago/Detroit acid sound and utilised to good effect by S.U.F. n friends, as we know...

Basically, in my eyes, they stole this ethos from the Acid techno scene and used it to boost there own... Teaming up with the larger Hard dance scene will have seemed financially attractive at the time but I think it watered down the strength and purpose and meaning that S.U.F. represented....

The Hard Dance scene just took and gave nothing back, which makes my blood boil...