selling your music

[epidemic001]

Hi everyone,

Just after your opinions on this as music producers yourselves.
Im looking at setting up a website service which provides you with a full website including an ecommerce/shopping cart system that allows you to sell your music to customers as downloads.
All payments would go to your paypal account and would be completely automated so you dont have to do anything except upload your new tracks to your site.
You can also edit the look of the site yourself without the need to know any coding etc

What I was maybe thinking of doing is charging a monthly fee which includes your web hosting and technical support.

Would this interest you and how much would you be willing to pay per month for the service?

John

[eyeswithoutaface]

it's a bit of a minefield this. I wouldnt someone a monthly fee to sell my music basically. Unless i was totally 100% sure that the sales they would help me get would cover that fee. What happens if you put some tracks up and no one buys them, and maybe not because they arent good tracks, but maybe because of other factors they cant control, like poor promotion on part of the website, an unworking website that throws up problems etc etc. Especially not when it's not that difficult to sort out distribution from the bigger mp3 lots such as Beatport, Trackitdown etc etc who will ultimately give your music a much, much wider audience compared to a, and no offence of course but business wise, a service that operates on a much, much smaller budget and doesnt have a reputation to help it along the way.

personal level, great idea, of course, always good to push and help others push good music. Business wise, alot easier for even relative newcomers to sort out much more comprehensible, workable and beneficial alternatives. For people who've had good success with their records too so far, it's even easier, hook up with the right labels and the label's will take care of all that anyway

[epidemic001]

I wouldnt be selling your music for you, I would be providing you with your own website which has the ability for users to listen to and buy your music directly. All sales would go straight into your paypal account (no cut taken).
the promotional aspect would be down to the owner of the site.

So the site owner would have the freedom to sell their tracks for as little or as much as they like and be able to create an indivdual brand for themselves while telling the user about themselves, news etc rather than just another name in a pile of thousands of others on sites like trackitdown.

You could of course use places like trackitdown to get your material distributed and use this as a kind of hq where people can get more info on you with the bonus of making more per sale.

[eyeswithoutaface]

Charging a monthly fee is essentially taking a cut. Like i said, if people arent selling through the site for whatever reason, and still having to pay the monthly fee, i think more people would simply stop using the site to host their tracks.

The thing is you have to have a direct market with such an amateur, in the business sense, project. People who are already having no problems getting onto labels, getting onto netlabels etc on the whole in my opinion wont be too interested, simply because when you hit a certain level then people will be willing to take care of that for you. Even something simple like getting a record signed, once you've given them the tracks you dont really have to do anything else except sit back and wait for the release to come out, be it a netlabel or a vinyl/cd label, and if it sells well enough to harness profit then you'l recieve that anyway (as long as your not being ripped off of course, which is something the individual has to sort out themselves, but that's where a good contract comes in, something which everyone should insist on if they are not feeling too good about a project).

Creating an individual brand doesnt come into it, just selling your music online isnt creating a brand, it's simply just selling your music. Which is great. One thing techno needs less of is branding.

when i say promotional aspect, it is 100% down to the people setting up the service to promote the actual service available, not the artist. It is however up to the artist to promote their particular site. So if the people behind the whole project have a small budget, are not promoting in magazines, are not banner sharing with other bigger sites or which other artists on their sites, are not telling everyone on the forums that they have a service available, then that's not the artists fault. If the artist doesnt tell people about their particular site then of course that's there fault.

but like i say you need to establish your market beforehand as it's pretty vague right now. If your hoping to get established, well named producers on board then i would it quite minimal in chances because the opportunity to promote and be heard/known on a much larger scale and with alot more help is simply too widely available.

you need totally honest opinions on projects like this because too many people just throw these kind of sites up and not much really happens, i've been involved with these kind of sites before, and agencies that run in the same manner, and my experience is that they dont do much for you whatsoever, in terms of getting you out there, getting your music heard and more importantly getting people to buy your music

and if your music is being distributed by sites such as Trackitdown, Beatport etc etc then the likelihood is that people know who you are anyway, so little bits of information arent really needed, people dont go to sites like Beatport to find new artists purposely, they go simply to buy music they like, and if they happen to discover new artists in this way thats a bonus. And i dont know anyone whose actively releasing music in whatever medium that doesnt have their own website with all relevant information, and more importantly alot of the time, offer their music as FREE downloads

It cost's relatively little to set up a netlabel these days, practically nothing sometimes, so alot of people really dont mind offering music for free. I know i dont, i release on numerous labels digital and vinyl but anyone who knows me knows they only have to ask if they want some new music gratis, as usually its the best promotion you cant buy

[RDR]

Charging a monthly fee is essentially taking a cut. Like i said, if people arent selling through the site for whatever reason, and still having to pay the monthly fee, i think more people would simply stop using the site to host their tracks.

The thing is you have to have a direct market with such an amateur, in the business sense, project. People who are already having no problems getting onto labels, getting onto netlabels etc on the whole in my opinion wont be too interested, simply because when you hit a certain level then people will be willing to take care of that for you. Even something simple like getting a record signed, once you've given them the tracks you dont really have to do anything else except sit back and wait for the release to come out, be it a netlabel or a vinyl/cd label, and if it sells well enough to harness profit then you'l recieve that anyway (as long as your not being ripped off of course, which is something the individual has to sort out themselves, but that's where a good contract comes in, something which everyone should insist on if they are not feeling too good about a project).

Creating an individual brand doesnt come into it, just selling your music online isnt creating a brand, it's simply just selling your music. Which is great. One thing techno needs less of is branding.

when i say promotional aspect, it is 100% down to the people setting up the service to promote the actual service available, not the artist. It is however up to the artist to promote their particular site. So if the people behind the whole project have a small budget, are not promoting in magazines, are not banner sharing with other bigger sites or which other artists on their sites, are not telling everyone on the forums that they have a service available, then that's not the artists fault. If the artist doesnt tell people about their particular site then of course that's there fault.

but like i say you need to establish your market beforehand as it's pretty vague right now. If your hoping to get established, well named producers on board then i would it quite minimal in chances because the opportunity to promote and be heard/known on a much larger scale and with alot more help is simply too widely available.

you need totally honest opinions on projects like this because too many people just throw these kind of sites up and not much really happens, i've been involved with these kind of sites before, and agencies that run in the same manner, and my experience is that they dont do much for you whatsoever, in terms of getting you out there, getting your music heard and more importantly getting people to buy your music

and if your music is being distributed by sites such as Trackitdown, Beatport etc etc then the likelihood is that people know who you are anyway, so little bits of information arent really needed, people dont go to sites like Beatport to find new artists purposely, they go simply to buy music they like, and if they happen to discover new artists in this way thats a bonus. And i dont know anyone whose actively releasing music in whatever medium that doesnt have their own website with all relevant information, and more importantly alot of the time, offer their music as FREE downloads

It cost's relatively little to set up a netlabel these days, practically nothing sometimes, so alot of people really dont mind offering music for free. I know i dont, i release on numerous labels digital and vinyl but anyone who knows me knows they only have to ask if they want some new music gratis, as usually its the best promotion you cant buy

+1

Also to add.

(just my thoughts, im not making personal comments on your venture (GOOD LUCK I SAY!!!!!!!! GOOD LUCK TO YOU!!!))

The process of running a shop, particularly with a cart is not a cheap business, and the pond you will be swimming in is an extremely large one, with already major established players, asking people to pay a fee so you can sell their music is not an idea to run with for most major artists, especially well known ones who are likely to give you greater margins. (after all they are the commodity) the flip side of the coin is that getting keen new artists who might stump up the cash (even if and unless they are genius producers) is a hiding to nothing, all it will do is give you a reputation as a seller of low grade music. and could potentially damage your reputation.

Look at people who offer a similar service, CD baby are a great one, they also offer some VERY good advice on their site for nothing, something i recommed you read. As an artist i would only pay for the following:

1. Well produced and lower cost physical product such as 2page colour sealed CDs
2. A trail of marketing and promotion which could be easily accessible for my fans and in the faces of the people i need to reach.

I would not pay for:

1. Low grade promotions in the wrong places
2. The 'Chance' to promote myself.
3. a Label or online shop who charges me and then leaves me to promote myself totally.

One of the biggest complaints artist have about labels, espeically when their music sales dont go anywhere is 'The label didnt promote it enough' sure its both parties responsibilities but in this age of solo producers being 10 a penny, they are not likely to be gigging or following the promotional pathways traditionally trodden by bands and gigging artists, and therefore are more likely to be looking to you for inspiration promotional wise and in terms of marketing.

Perhaps you might be better reframing yourself as a service that promotes artists music, now THAT is worth something, time. Websites are not time, they are not active entitiies unless attached to big communities. The personal touch is still what counts. Promoting artists who are worth it will reap rewards for both promoter and artist in the long run.

From my perspective the setup of the label has been a real ball ache, especially considering i have chosen to try and find the best deals for our artists and are not tying them in, rather we act as a promotional frontage / running men and marketeers on their behalf. I have to disagree with scott to certain extent, branding is important but only when the branding says something people want to listen to and has an ethos that doesnt trample on the mind with pointless sloganeering and leaves a taste in the mouth which is only slightly stonger than oxygen. symbols of bloody monkeys and gorillas and any ****ing ape of any sort do my head in, its cheesy tacky money making riding on the back of a image which will be gone in 2 years time.

Long term plans are important and you need to make sure yours are in place. industry contacts take time to foment, especially the ones which might be of use to you.

Hope this helps, doesnt dis-hearten and gives you confidence to continue with your venture!!!

Chris.

[RDR]

Just to add..

if you are entering into agreements with your artists you need to make SURE that the agreements protect both you and them. its only what people expect.

You mean non-exclusive agreements i suspect.

[epidemic001]

thanks for the feedback!!!

Its certainly given me alot to think about.