Too much influence?

[dirty_bass]

Well you have to ackowledge that some of the most creative and innovative music that has been made and recorded would probably never have happened if not for drugs.
opening your mind is one thing though
hammering your brain so you can barely operate equipment or getting to the state where inspiration only comes through drugs is a whole other problem.
I tend to think that drug music only entertains drug people, but that`s not always the case.

[The Overfiend]

Even something like getting stoned in the studio can impede progress and rational thinking, and 4 hours later your still sitting there stoned with the same loop playing. That's not innovation to me

Agreed, anything I have made when operating in that mind frame I have been quite embarassed about and have totally cut that aspect out of my life.
Due to health constraints I am now in a clean and sober prison called my body.

[eyeswithoutaface]

my bad, misunderstood the first part of your post there mate, and it wont let me edit for some reason...

but still stand firm on the drugs comment, i dont understand that at all, i actually feel a little sorry for anyone who needs drugs to trigger their musical creation/output

a person's imagination is alot more clear and healthier without an un-natural substance clouding it up, imo

[eyeswithoutaface]

Well you have to ackowledge that some of the most creative and innovative music that has been made and recorded would probably never have happened if not for drugs.
opening your mind is one thing though
hammering your brain so you can barely operate equipment or getting to the state where inspiration only comes through drugs is a whole other problem.
I tend to think that drug music only entertains drug people, but that`s not always the case.

well yeah, but i feel innovation is subjective, one mans turd and all that, and more often than not, when someone presents me with a piece of music that was made by someone on drugs, 99% of the time it sounds just that, music that's been made on drugs. Il use someone like Frank Zappa as an example, because im a huge fan of guitar music and non electronic music shall we say, and the amount of times people have said to me "oh Zappa is amazing, made his stuff off his face on acid" and what not, and ive just listened and heard not much except someone losing it on acid. But of course i know what you mean and im sure there are exceptions to the rule, i just dont personally think drugs are a good catalyst for creation, regardless of how many examples someone would put infront of me, as for me the amount of good music available that WASNT made by someone off thier head far out weights the amount of music that WAS made by someone off their head

for me anyway, like i say, its all pretty subjective

[eyeswithoutaface]

Agreed, anything I have made when operating in that mind frame I have been quite embarassed about and have totally cut that aspect out of my life.
Due to health constraints I am now in a clean and sober prison called my body.

yep same here mate now

had my fill of pretty much everything

[clubsynthetic]

for one, drugs make a vast difference to perception which is what innovation is all about isn't it. expanding imagination!! You don't need to be constantly under the influence to change you perseption forever!

But yes too many drugs incapacitate one's self. Look at Hendrix good and bad...

You either copy something already done or make it up in your imagination. simple. you copy or you don't - consiously or subconsiously.

and i ain't had my fill of drugs by a long shot so there.

so we can't listen to too much techno ro do drugs for our best chances of innovative music - where shalt we get oor ideas?

[eyeswithoutaface]

for one, drugs make a vast difference to perception which is what innovation is all about isn't it. expanding imagination!! You don't need to be constantly under the influence to change you perseption forever!

But yes too many drugs incapacitate one's self. Look at Hendrix good and bad...

You either copy something already done or make it up in your imagination. simple. you copy or you don't - consiously or subconsiously.

and i ain't had my fill of drugs by a long shot so there.

so we can't listen to too much techno ro do drugs for our best chances of innovative music - where shalt we get oor ideas?

chill out, no ones saying dont do drugs or listen to as much techno as you want, as influence affects different people in different ways. It's simply not as clear cut as that at all.

I know people who have never touched drugs in their whole life yet make absolutely beautiful, thought provoking music, just the same as i know people who get seriously walloped as often as they can and make their own brand of music too, but to me the first is 99% of the time the best.

its got nothing to do with how many drugs you've had or if you've had your fill of them either, no one suggested otherwise

and there are PLENTY of places to get ideas apart from techno or drugs, we live in a world totally full of inspiration.

i unfortunately lost my grandmother this year, and ive wrote a song about her. It has turned out to be the single most emotional and personal thing ive ever written, and i actually cant play it that often even on my own because it upsets me, but its also helped me come to terms with her loss. No drugs involved. No techno involved, just raw emotion

[clubsynthetic]

and yes it is all subjective. but generally people can tell good from shite whatever music genre they listen to.

i would say a way of judging the amount of innovation is your reaction to the particular music you are listing to and the reaction of everyone else listeing to it too. The more people surprised or interested in what seems to them to be a new groove, the more innovative no?

[clubsynthetic]

chill out, no ones saying dont do drugs or listen to as much techno as you want, as influence affects different people in different ways. It's simply not as clear cut as that at all.

I know people who have never touched drugs in their whole life yet make absolutely beautiful, thought provoking music, just the same as i know people who get seriously walloped as often as they can and make their own brand of music too, but to me the first is 99% of the time the best.

its got nothing to do with how many drugs you've had or if you've had your fill of them either, no one suggested otherwise

and there are PLENTY of places to get ideas apart from techno or drugs, we live in a world totally full of inspiration.

i unfortunately lost my grandmother this year, and ive wrote a song about her. It has turned out to be the single most emotional and personal thing ive ever written, and i actually cant play it that often even on my own because it upsets me, but its also helped me come to terms with her loss. No drugs involved. No techno involved, just raw emotion

I'm perfectly cool mate, just a crap joke.

[eyeswithoutaface]

and yes it is all subjective. but generally people can tell good from shite whatever music genre they listen to.

i would say a way of judging the amount of innovation is your reaction to the particular music you are listing to and the reaction of everyone else listeing to it too. The more people surprised or interested in what seems to them to be a new groove, the more innovative no?

you'd be suprised. I think techno as a whole is one of the best examples where 99% of the time, those who are being truely innovative get overlooked for the most popular artist at the time

[eyeswithoutaface]

I'm perfectly cool mate, just a crap joke.

no worries mate, little misunderstanding i think

[force]

and its got nothing to do with drugs at all to be fair, i dont see a role that drugs can play in production on any level.

I dunno, it didn't do the beatles any harm.

Although, i know what you mean about getting stoned and listening to the same loop for 4 hours! :ohdear:

[clubsynthetic]

you'd be suprised. I think techno as a whole is one of the best examples where 99% of the time, those who are being truely innovative get overlooked for the most popular artist at the time

Yeah thats true but do these people go straight for what they think or are they actually that shallow to listen to really good music and ignore it?

Personally i think alot of people just don't bother listening to what they don't know. what about the people who have had a listen, if its good they usually listen again i would think.

[clubsynthetic]

Although, i know what you mean about getting stoned and listening to the same loop for 4 hours! :ohdear:

personally i would call that reconnaissance ;)

[detfella]

well yeah, but i feel innovation is subjective, one mans turd and all that, and more often than not, when someone presents me with a piece of music that was made by someone on drugs, 99% of the time it sounds just that, music that's been made on drugs. Il use someone like Frank Zappa as an example, because im a huge fan of guitar music and non electronic music shall we say, and the amount of times people have said to me "oh Zappa is amazing, made his stuff off his face on acid" and what not, and ive just listened and heard not much except someone losing it on acid. But of course i know what you mean and im sure there are exceptions to the rule, i just dont personally think drugs are a good catalyst for creation, regardless of how many examples someone would put infront of me, as for me the amount of good music available that WASNT made by someone off thier head far out weights the amount of music that WAS made by someone off their head

for me anyway, like i say, its all pretty subjective

funny you should pick zappa because he didn't take drugs and actively campaigned drug-taking since the 60s. he wouldnt let band members take them on the road either!

good topic scott. agree with steve in that too much of 1 style stagnates the mind & body. i enjoy listening to as much music as possible from here there and everywhere, but this leaves one problem...no time to make music! it can be compared with knowledge once you know what is out there you can try & do different or build on it. if you dont know it already exsists you might repeat...thought i'd just have a splatter of words

[detfella]

oh i forgot to say, zappa rules!! love his music & lyrics. but i love fusion rock jazz blues stuff so that aint no big suprise!

[detfella]

haha

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ohVpYt_S8lY

[eyeswithoutaface]

I dunno, it didn't do the beatles any harm.

Although, i know what you mean about getting stoned and listening to the same loop for 4 hours! :ohdear:

that's true, but they were doing perfectly alright before they got into their drug phase to be fair, and there is eternal debate as to wether or not their heavy foray into drugs and spiritualism contributed to their break up, so for some people drugs had a devastating effect on the beatles, but again its subjective, but still a fair point of course

but there is a difference between producing off your head and writing songs off your head, in the traditional sense. I mean, ive had nights where ive been tripping my head off, writing songs, with the mics running, and when ive listened back in the morning.... errr lets just say it got deleted from the 4 track haha

[eyeswithoutaface]

funny you should pick zappa because he didn't take drugs and actively campaigned drug-taking since the 60s. he wouldnt let band members take them on the road either!

good topic scott. agree with steve in that too much of 1 style stagnates the mind & body. i enjoy listening to as much music as possible from here there and everywhere, but this leaves one problem...no time to make music! it can be compared with knowledge once you know what is out there you can try & do different or build on it. if you dont know it already exsists you might repeat...thought i'd just have a splatter of words

well i wouldnt know as gospel, with zappa ive only ever gone on what people have recommended and told me stories about, ive never been able to get into him or researched him or what he was about, but i think this is a bit of an on going debate as alot of people seem to be convinced he was a space cadet, whilst it is documented in various places that he was as you say anti drugs

either way its tosh to me ;)

[eyeswithoutaface]

Yeah thats true but do these people go straight for what they think or are they actually that shallow to listen to really good music and ignore it?

Personally i think alot of people just don't bother listening to what they don't know. what about the people who have had a listen, if its good they usually listen again i would think.

in my experience, alot of people sometimes dont actually understand certain music when they hear it, and this breeds a certain level of embarrasment or pressure to fit in and they ultimately end up plumping for something that whilst liking at the same time, they can actually talk about and understand. Which is fine, its horses for courses as they say

shaping up into a lovely thread this, top draw lads