wow. this is a massive massive massive subject :!:

but i've had a few Stella's hehe so please bear with me :) BUT....

hakka, you've probably created the post of the year as far as i'm concerned. and i love you for it.. and also please dont take any offence from what i'm about to write but it's all with a masive passion i hope you see this ;) hmm.. ok here's goes nothing:

this post is replicated every single year in some shape or form or another in some different way within all music genres. to me, the key is: postivitity AND change. that's what keeps me going and will always keep me going.

please let's try to stay +ve whilst we all talk about this...anyway, enough of the crap.

Now the scary shit as far as you're concerned?!?!!? (IMO):

1) Hardstyle HAS fragmented the Hard Trance scene.
2) Hard trance (of the 00-03 variety) IS dying out in the UK/Worldwide
3) Hard/Club music is changing

Right NOW the good shit:

1) Everything MUST change. Had we not had the same shit in 1992, trance would never have been born. TBH none of this dance music thing would have been born were it not for breaking up of music/conflicting ideas/change.
2) Music needs to change or else everything sounds the same. We need to get new ppl into our movement. Our scene keeps fresh.

You know, I get soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo ****in disheartened with this music movement sometimes. it's like everyone is scared of change - the very opposite of what this music is about!!! please for gods sake guys!!!! can't you see change is a good thing??? sure things were great as they were but love those memories, keep them close to your heart... but move on.

hakka mate, you talk about 'our sound' like it's a sound that is 'ours'. surely it's the 'attitude' about the music that is 'ours', not the sound??? or am i talking shit??

hmm... it's such a masive topic and one that will talked about forever. but yet music will go forward. what i'm bothered about is how we keep those friendships we've formed, that ethos and that felling that was so important when we joined this music thing???? surely you all joined it could it was like nothing else you'd ever heard/witnessed/seen ie a mixture of the above ;)

anyway quote your post:

I would definitely say that the majority of dance clubs are having a rough time of it at the moment, and us at the harder end of things don't help each other with the constant turmoil between genres. There now is even a big divide between hardstyle & hard trance, which doesn't help bring new comers to our sound, because our scene looks so volatile. Added to the fact of the larger clubs shutting for various reasons (not all unpopularity) and the music just not being as good anymore, it's harder to get new people interested, and that's where the lifeblood of clubs is.
Music not as good anymore?!!?!?!!!!!! Are you not record shopping?!?!?!!! You have to search. ITS AN AMAZING TIME FOR MUSIC!!! Ppl can get everything so easy BUT What can be more exciting than having to look hard?!!?!!! I dont doubt you are mate but come on!!!........

Also: Harder to get new ppl interested? Hmmm.. I can see this from certain DJ's, but me... no chance. I really feel I'm getting alot of new ppl on board at the mo. Whether that's techno into trance or vica versa, wow this is a really important time. There's so much -veity out there. we all have a chance to make a difference right now and I hope I'm doing my bit.

I suppose only people like Mark EG and M-Zone can offer the best opinion on this, but is the clubbing scene for hard trance & hard style dissappearing or reducing?
errmm.. evolving... ;)

We've seen the closure of many clubs... Candy Store in Plymouth (now opened again but half capacity in different location), Country Club closed, Monastrey shut down, Subterrania ended, North finishing...

It seems like established nights are shutting down and one off nights with DJ's scraping the pounds together to barely break even is what is left these days. What is going on???
evolution... it's sad but true....

I know so many people who make a constant loss just so they can play out. Its harsh... but it just feels that there is nowhere near the amount of people in to underground music as there used to be.
If I'm going to be 100% honest with you I'll say that you're right IF you're talking about the South West Hard Trance Scene 1 yr/2yrs ago . As far as 'underground' music goes, I dont think we could be any stronger. I really feel we're all on a mission like never before.

PPL need to evolve and understand evolution.

Hope everyone else understands...