Should music be given away free?

[detfella]

no, thats not what i'm saying at all.

what were you trying to say?

[MorePunkThanFunk]

interesting read all this.

i'll put my opinion in.

I personally don't think music should be given away free. Art has a value and if you like something you should pay for it.

I 100% agree with promotion and giving away stuff is part of that.

But i feel that all this giving away of tracks is de-valueing the music industry. Particuarly the underground scene, which is already undervalued.

We run the risk of the scene turning into a bunch of part-timers. You need guys out there doing this as there full time job really pushing the scene and the music and generally doing a good job of it.

Loving the scene is not a good enough reason to do it for free. I love my job... would i do it for free? Would i hell.

If you have a good day in work and your boss says "well you've enjoyed yourself today so i'm not paying you" you'd be like what the ****

So why should artists be forced to do the same?

On the other hand i'm being slightly hypocritical here as with my label i like to increase the perceived value by doing full colour artwork and giving away free things in the records... in the process i can't really afford to pay the artists for there tracks as i would be loosing money on each release. So i'm in the dilemma, do i cut production costs and pay for tracks or do i keep going doing what i'm doing? But from a promotion perspective the artists tracks being on my label promotes them... should that be enough... i don't really think so!

It's a tough one

The only thing i do know is that we should support the underground and keep it thriving and buying records is a BIG part of this.

[rhythmtech]

see heres where i think the problem lies.

labels arent in a position to put out as many releases as they used to be. so what if a lad has a really good track but, for whatever reasons, it never gets picked up for release. should he a. sit on for an undetermined amount of time or B. give it away for free, thus (hopefully) raising his profile in an attempt to get gigs/releases

[davethedrummer]

what were you trying to say?

not what you said thats for sure

[DannyBlack]

anyway book me i'm cheap !

do you swallow? its a deal breaker.

[morbid]

Music should cost something whatever the format - youre basically buying the right to use / replay someone else's work. There's a difference between an artist choosing to distribute their music for free and someone else making that choice for the artist by uploading whats not theirs.

Lets face it if youre in the UK and making a living out of techno youre probably doing just that - making a living, not creaming money in left right and centre and wiping your ass with £50 notes

The original artist deserves some return on their ideas - whatever that re
turn is (hard cash / promotion etc)

If you make pies and youre having trouble shifting them then give them away - your choice. If your hungry you dont generally go and steal a pie you buy one. If youre pies taste better than anyone elses around then people will buy your pies........

Just my thoughts

[morbid]

anyone for steak and kidney?

[rhythmtech]

There's a difference between an artist choosing to distribute their music for free

thats exactly what we're talking about here. not illegal downloads.

[morbid]

fair enough - I think its 2 sides of the same coin though, the music is still free however you get it and whoever is giving it away.

[morbid]

I just think there should be some monetary value to new original music

[tocsin]

I've just got a fundamentally different view here, since I never have considered, nor will I ever consider, my own artistic creativity my job. And I don't ever want it to be. I got into this sound and culture as a direct result of the h/p scene, where I ran a dial up system based on freedom of information and using technology towards something bigger than the acquisition of personal income. What's funny is, I don't ever remember catching crap from techno artists when BBS's were used to distribute original mod files about how this hurt things. It's utterly bizzarre to me that one artist who charges gives a **** about what ohers do for free inside a free scene.

One of the coolest things about this thing for me was that there was now the ability for everybody with access to a machine, or other affordable hardware, to make music consisting of multiple instruments and sounds for the same cost, or cheaper, than the price of one good midrange instrument, nevermind the communication abilities that were opened. It helped smash some otherwise economic barriers that prevented people from realising something they enjoyed. Piracy has allowed for the same when it comes to software.

But, now, because some people have made money, or are relying on making money, with a sound that so many of us have loved and put into, we're supposed to change our ways and not give it away for free if we don't want to? This is peoples' music. It's now become, in a very real way, a newer incarnation of folk music for those of us blessed enough to be part of the world with access to affordable tech. Blaming artists for the downfall of other artists' income sources, simply because they post music on the net for free, is a relatively new excuse. And it's a bogus one. If an artist giving away music for free is so good that they've become a threat to your income, sign them! Though, I just don't know what fantasy land this is where artists who are giving away music for free have had the same promotion and recognition as signed artists, and promoters who are spending dollars on a venue that need door and drink sales are willing to take risks on them.

[rhythmtech]

I just think there should be some monetary value to new original music

we'd all love that.

believe me, most of the time labels cant even afford to pay artists for full releases.

its just the way things have gotten.

[JamieBall]

If you make pies and youre having trouble shifting them then give them away - your choice. If your hungry you dont generally go and steal a pie you buy one. If youre pies taste better than anyone elses around then people will buy your pies........

DAMN - I wish there was a "slsk" for pies, could do with downloading a pork n pickle one - and maybe a steak for later on.

[acidsaturation]

But, now, because some people have made money, or are relying on making money, with a sound that so many of us have loved and put into, we're supposed to change our ways and not give it away for free if we don't want to? This is peoples' music. It's now become, in a very real way, a newer incarnation of folk music for those of us blessed enough to be part of the world with access to affordable tech. Blaming artists for the downfall of other artists' income sources, simply because they post music on the net for free, is a relatively new excuse. And it's a bogus one. If an artist giving away music for free is so good that they've become a threat to your income, sign them! Though, I just don't know what fantasy land this is where artists who are giving away music for free have had the same promotion and recognition as signed artists, and promoters who are spending dollars on a venue that need door and drink sales are willing to take risks on them.

I'm 100% behind this. Music is music, it won't die because people can't afford a living from it. Some people always will be able to, some won't. There's plenty of a music scene where people do stuff for free round where I live. Gigs put of for free, bands play for free, etc etc. It's fun. OK they don't get to fly around playing uber big gigs.

At the end of the day: I make music 'cos it's fun. Maybe it's good enough for release, maybe not. At the moment I don't have the time or energy or start-up costs to try and get it on vinyl. And I'm not bothered.

But if I want to give it to someone who might enjoy it no other ****er has the right to tell me not to. Like I said, that's like if Bill Gates tried to stop linux, or Steinberg refused to let people make VSTs for free, or superclubs say we are not allowed to have free parties. (OK that last one kinda happens, and we don't give them any respect...)

If someone who's a name artist is getting scared by bedroom producers giving stuff for free then why is that? Maybe we do all need to look at the value of this commodity, if it can be given away maybe it isn't worth as much as we'd like to think.

But on the flip side, techno (for me at least) was always a little (dare I use the word) underground, subversive, etc etc, and going against big corporate industry models is a part of that.

When people start saying that we have to lose the free diy ethic that was always a part for many people, **** it, I'm going back to punk!

[TechMouse]

now who's deluded?
that what is really destroying the industry too few people of Henry, Guy, Immersion's calibre. And two many big name Techno artists who nobody gives a **** about, the reason they have to give their music away is cos no ****er will be buy it in the first place. don't fool yourself.

Is it really so long ago that we all forget how people like Henry, Guy, Lawrie, the Liberators and the rest of the Stay Up Forever lot jump started a scene based on a free party ethic and giving a big fuck you to the music industry establishment?

[MorePunkThanFunk]

I'm 100% behind this. Music is music, it won't die because people can't afford a living from it. Some people always will be able to, some won't. There's plenty of a music scene where people do stuff for free round where I live. Gigs put of for free, bands play for free, etc etc. It's fun. OK they don't get to fly around playing uber big gigs.

At the end of the day: I make music 'cos it's fun. Maybe it's good enough for release, maybe not. At the moment I don't have the time or energy or start-up costs to try and get it on vinyl. And I'm not bothered.

But if I want to give it to someone who might enjoy it no other ****er has the right to tell me not to. Like I said, that's like if Bill Gates tried to stop linux, or Steinberg refused to let people make VSTs for free, or superclubs say we are not allowed to have free parties. (OK that last one kinda happens, and we don't give them any respect...)

If someone who's a name artist is getting scared by bedroom producers giving stuff for free then why is that? Maybe we do all need to look at the value of this commodity, if it can be given away maybe it isn't worth as much as we'd like to think.

But on the flip side, techno (for me at least) was always a little (dare I use the word) underground, subversive, etc etc, and going against big corporate industry models is a part of that.

When people start saying that we have to lose the free diy ethic that was always a part for many people, **** it, I'm going back to punk!

I don't think anyone is getting scared by bedroom producers. I just think that it is a worrying trend that music is given away for free.

i just strongly feel that music & art has a value and if you like it you should support the creator and help him/her create more of that product.

[rhythmtech]

i just strongly feel that music & art has a value and if you like it you should support the creator and help him/her create more of that product.

totally. but thats down to the consumer. the onus isnt on the artist to charge, especially if they have no means of doing so. maybe people should start offering donations for free downloads (direct from the artist)... doubt it though

[Aratron]

Is it really so long ago that we all forget how people like Henry, Guy, Lawrie, the Liberators and the rest of the Stay Up Forever lot jump started a scene based on a free party ethic and giving a big fuck you to the music industry establishment?

and made some amazing music. with fantastic artwork and sleeve designs. wasn' that chaotic. And i figure nearly all of those guys is doing relatively well for themselves.
I remember about 7 years ago, Chris Lib getting married and going to Hawaii for 3 weeks. whilst my friend Techno Phil would tell everybody he lived with his mum in a council flat in Hackney (sure). Bizarre Counter-Transference.

[acidsaturation]

i just strongly feel that music & art has a value and if you like it you should support the creator and help him/her create more of that product.

But what if the creator wants to do it for free. That's his/her choice.

Should I say to the guy who does brilliant graffiti all round Leeds he shouldn't do it, cos it devalues people who make a living from fine art.

I notice not one person has answered my question about should this apply to making and giving away software for free. Or is that different 'cos it's someone else's industry. Surely it's the same?

I feel greatly that music has a value, but I personally feel that if you can afford to give something for free you should be allowed to without others saying it's stepping on their toes.

[acidsaturation]

Is it really so long ago that we all forget how people like Henry, Guy, Lawrie, the Liberators and the rest of the Stay Up Forever lot jump started a scene based on a free party ethic and giving a big fuck you to the music industry establishment?

This is what has saddened me slightly about this thread too!