Should you give your music away ?

[tonyc2002]

I want to read more about this subject.
Seriously, I'm going pretty much everywhere to find some label to release an EP I worked hard on. And personally, the goal within this is just to get my music listened at, not getting money out of it (altough it would be pleasing since studies cost a lot these days but let's be realist, who the f*** would buy some song from some newcomer they never heard of?).
Should I stop sending CDs to labels and come over and give my music for free? =S

I wouldn't mind hearing your music! :)

[cossinnelle]

I think there are a few problems falling in an "all free" system :

- Labels make their selection and try to ensure a certain level of quality, that's their work and they have to do it well if they want to sell. Will quality remain if labels no more exist?

- In fact I think quality tracks would still exist, but that leads me to my second point : how will the djs find the music they like? will they have to go from myspace to myspace to listen to three or four tracks each time, making a prayer and hopping each time that they will at least find a nice track? When I see the time I spend on juno to find so few tracks I really like, I can't imagine what it would be if everyone would distrubute his music (even fo free) by himself....

- Last but not least, and that's the logical conclusion of what I've said above, that would be very hard for new artists to get their audience. Now labels can find new artists and bring them to light through websites that reach a large audience such as juno, chemical and so on...
without those interfaces new artists would stay in the shadow.

[Jay Pace]

Not everyone can do it for free. Most people are trying to get heard. If you haven't got the reputation you need to use the resources and reputations of labels to get noticed.

But if you're in the position where people are actively looking for your stuff, and you already have loads of fans, and platforms to connect with them, why would you ask them to pay an online shop, a distributor & a label for your music when you could just give it to them for nothing and make more money out of it?

[davethedrummer]

I think there are a few problems falling in an "all free" system :

- Labels make their selection and try to ensure a certain level of quality, that's their work and they have to do it well if they want to sell. Will quality remain if labels no more exist?

- In fact I think quality tracks would still exist, but that leads me to my second point : how will the djs find the music they like? will they have to go from myspace to myspace to listen to three or four tracks each time, making a prayer and hopping each time that they will at least find a nice track? When I see the time I spend on juno to find so few tracks I really like, I can't imagine what it would be if everyone would distrubute his music (even fo free) by himself....

- Last but not least, and that's the logical conclusion of what I've said above, that would be very hard for new artists to get their audience. Now labels can find new artists and bring them to light through websites that reach a large audience such as juno, chemical and so on...
without those interfaces new artists would stay in the shadow.

I see what you are saying here
and it's true as of now.
But think of where the current networking sites want to be in say, 2 years all linked up sharing friends and contacts ,a total cross pollenation of networking sites
and I don't think you'll have to run round the internet looking for peoples tracks any more.
I think the ones you like will drop into your inbox once you have made contact with the labels or people you want to follow.
it's already happening now really.

interesting point about the artist who already has exposure ie: radiohead
yeah that makes sense, I suppose I have my fans too, so I could do a couple of freebies as pressies for the fans and also maybe to reach new ears too.
maybe a couple of free ones
and then an album or something like that?

it's food for thought

[SlavikSvensk]

I think there are a few problems falling in an "all free" system :

- Labels make their selection and try to ensure a certain level of quality, that's their work and they have to do it well if they want to sell. Will quality remain if labels no more exist?

- In fact I think quality tracks would still exist, but that leads me to my second point : how will the djs find the music they like? will they have to go from myspace to myspace to listen to three or four tracks each time, making a prayer and hopping each time that they will at least find a nice track? When I see the time I spend on juno to find so few tracks I really like, I can't imagine what it would be if everyone would distrubute his music (even fo free) by himself....

- Last but not least, and that's the logical conclusion of what I've said above, that would be very hard for new artists to get their audience. Now labels can find new artists and bring them to light through websites that reach a large audience such as juno, chemical and so on...
without those interfaces new artists would stay in the shadow.

this is where i was going too. right now techno is in danger of becoming an oligarchy, where a very small number of established artists dominate the business side of things. while getting music to fans cheaply or even for free is great, if it becomes widespread, the digital labels will die. if they die, then the ability to reach a certain level of exposure will be completely in the hands of the 'techno aristocracy.'

like them or not, labels provide an essential service in sustaining some semblance of economic viability to techno beyond the stadium packers.

so yeah...henry please give some stuff away but please don't stop helping out the little labels!

[TechMouse]

When I was younger (and poorer) I used to spend most of my money on vinyl and pretty much download everything else. My rationale at the time being "I'm spending more money on music than most people I know, and it's going in at the grass roots level where it will do the most good". I would occasionally buy a high-quality audio file if I was planning to burn it to a CD to play out or something, provided it was DRM free and good quality - I had to ask for my money back a couple of times because a file was really dodgy.

Now I'm older and I have a bit more free cash I've started paying for things I really like. I discovered gofasterstripe.com and started buying some really good comedy DVDs. I've bought several digital albums this year already (the DubFX album, Insides by Jon Hopkins and Caesura by Helios) plus loads of individual tracks. I shelled out for my copy of Ableton. I even bought the full version of WinAMP (why not? I use it every day and it costs next to nothing). I also bought A Midsummer Nice Dream by Ochre on vinyl because Chris repressed it and it only cost £5.

I think my point is that people who really love music are always going to spend as much as they can reasonably afford on it. Those that don't probably don't love it as much, and you can't let those people drive your decision.

I think the donation model is great, but I would occasionally back it up with a value added product - e.g. a vinyl or CD (or DVD) in nice packaging with good artwork and <insert something else novel here>. That guy that gave away a free noise making circuit in the package of the CD was on to something.

[lunatrick]

personally I'm happy to pay for downloads, it's cheaper than vinyl anyway, and I don't want some dodgy copy, but the proper file in high quality. I think giving 'some' music away free is fair enough but to give everything away free seems a bit like paying to publish your own book really, a bit of a vanity project. If people won't pay for it then is it worth releasing?

There's got to be some mileage in releasing back catalogues, I'd certainly pay to download the whole hydraulix library, amoungst others.

For new comers it's bewildering really.....the latest release pages on beatport for just techno run into the hundreds. hundreds of pages of shite. I think juno and beatport should be just as selective as if they were paying up front for the vinyl.

Does anybody know how the download sites are doing? 909london for example, surely they must be generating some money?

[jon connor]

good topic, Henry.


Right. I personally came in at the wrong time to make money from music so I'm not going to delude myself into thinking I ever will. If someone likes a track and wants to release it, any money (if any) it makes they can put it into the label and thats how I like it. I never wanted this to be about money for me.

Again thats my personal view of how I want things to work for me. I have my other career to keep me in pence. That is, when I'm qualified etc...

This is the only side of it I know.

I think nowadays it is more performance orientated than say putting out CD's. The money to sustain what you do would come from shows that you put on (audio/visual)

If you want to make money from music, you have to be clever about it. Techno, whether we like it or not is an underground thing that will never enjoy any real commercial success. Im not saying make minimal- make other things, work on concepts- marketing stratergies. thats what business is- advertising and marketing and being bloody clever.

im not sure where i was heading with this- am i making sense?

fair play danny well said im the same as you here dude i have a career which will keep me in pence to but techno is my hobby and also a good source of social life for me and has been for 16 years so im thinking in the same way about giving future trax away as it may help with more bookings for gigs etc
but erm some of us are diffrent here and in it it for diffrnt reasons but yea i never thought of making a living from this just a great social life and intrests , some people play bingo hahahahahaha

Henry i wouldent give your stuff away to easy dude , if you are thinking about it then mabey try and have a time limit on the sale then mabey move into an area say set up on your hydraulix network you can put for free, that way in time you will not only please a lot of fans but have a nice back cat which will b availble at any time to retrieve i dunno just an idea man mabey have a hydraulix free section this may also increase the traffic to your site.

[SlavikSvensk]

what about netlabels? these, i think, retain some of the advantages of labels as filters but distribute directly and often for free

[DannyBlack]

Yeah I think the Net labels have a lot of Merrit and could be the way that most go. I think having an option to donate too would be a good idea.

[Microdot]

fcuk giving away music for free. if ppl want it for free they'll find a way to steal it anyway.

And cunts like Radiohead fully realise the damage they are doing to smaller artists and labels by doing so.
A point I made on here at the time, and subsequently supported by artists such as Daft Punk, Wu Tang Clan and Lily Allen in the established music press.
Anyone who doesn't understand why a mainstream act giving their music away free is bad for upcoming acts is an idiot.

[DannyBlack]

People were stealing a long time before acts were giving their music away. Personally I think the transfer to digital is what started the decline of the profit margin for musicians.

DJ's are digital, whether it be vinyl or ableton. Digital is much more accessible and stealable than it was in vinyls hayday.

Again I'm not involved enough to give a solid factual insight, but this is how I see it.

[MITA]

is true.

but take in mind Henry that you will make a culture of free music by giving it away,rather than learning newbies to buy and respect the artist and his work.

1 free release per year for the fans and followers is okay in my book.

[DannyBlack]

From what I can gather here, there are two views: Yes and No.

A rethink is needed. What do you guys think you can do to improve on the mess that it is at the moment?

[The Overfiend]

Keep sending your demo's
You'll be surprised who bites in the end.
Otherwise heed the opinions of respected peers as well in lieu of constructive criticism.

[teknorich]

I like the way these guys operate:

Mo`s Ferry Productions

All releases are on vinyl and mp3, but they have lots of bonus, digital-only tracks which are free to download.

I guess the idea is you download it for free so it gives you a taste of the record, it makes you curious and you listen to the samples of the other tracks on the release (which are streaming only, not free download) then hopefully you end up buying that release overall.

For those who would just soulseek the music anyway, it's a way to keep them interested in your label because you're giving away good quality mp3 files, and for those who still buy music it's a good way to get people's interest and hopefully sales in future.

Kind of a halfway house?!

[clubsynthetic]

Not had a chance to read all the post yet,, but everything should be free in my book! ;)

But aye, money is in the live performance... you can't fake that!

[clubsynthetic]

and anyway, why should radiohead give a **** about any other artists? Everyone's in it for the money! and if you ain't, don't cry about it.

I like to pay for shit just now if it means it's better. and i now know thats once every 6 months.. cos i'm broke all the time..

[SlavikSvensk]

fcuk giving away music for free. if ppl want it for free they'll find a way to steal it anyway.

And cunts like Radiohead fully realise the damage they are doing to smaller artists and labels by doing so.
A point I made on here at the time, and subsequently supported by artists such as Daft Punk, Wu Tang Clan and Lily Allen in the established music press.
Anyone who doesn't understand why a mainstream act giving their music away free is bad for upcoming acts is an idiot.

it's like everything else...with one hand it gives, and with the other it taketh away.

[Jay Pace]

Anyone who doesn't understand why a mainstream act giving their music away free is bad for upcoming acts is an idiot.

They didn't give it away for free though.
They made much more money, by not asking their fans to pay sales portals and distributors, and just pay them, the band, what they thought it was worth. Some gave them nothing. Others paid them what they though the album should cost.

Nobody is doing up and comers favours by releasing their music, so that it can sit on servers, where nobody hears it because nobody is prepared to buy something from an artist they've never heard. And thats in the event they can even find them in the first place, buried beneath a thousand tonnes of crap.

Nothing stopping labels going direct to fans either. They'd get a hell of a lot more out their artists if they didn't need to pay distributors and sales portals the majority cut just to get stocked and sold.

The main people threatened by people giving stuff away, are the people who offer no real value beyond the ability to sell.