Credit Crunch vs Arrogance of Big Names

[The_Laughing_Man]

I think you missed my point.
We can say it's not the artist it's the agent.
The agent's JOB is to make sure the artist and himself are paid.
Agent's are good because of shady promoters.
How many people on this very forum have travelled to some country they've never been to.
Or driven yay far from their houses to not be paid at the end of the night?
If we want to sit there and discuss making things better then maybe the title of the thread should be something along those lines.

Agents won`t protect you from this, people with agents still don`t get paid.

What will protect you from this is investigation and a bit of Savvy.

Again you miss the point entirely by labeling any discussion, discourse or debate as "Hate".

Nobody is being hated here, it`s just straight talking.
You say techno is like a family?

Well, the one thing you can rely on with famly above all else, above friends, is honesty.
You may be king of the world but your mum can still cut you down to the ground and bring you down to earth with the truth, rather than telling you how great you are all the time.

As adults we should be able to cope with criticism and fair debate, and yes disagreement, in a civilised and adult way.
Anyone who can`t take it or cries and stamps their feet needs to go back to school.

There`s nothing wrong with big ups as well, but when you bleet like a sheep about how great everyone is all the time, it just becomes meaningless noise.
It`s all about contrasts, light means nothing without darkness.

Credit where credit is due, and criticism also.

[gunjack]

There`s nothing wrong with big ups as well, but when you bleet like a sheep about how great everyone is all the time, it just becomes meaningless noise.
It`s all about contrasts, light means nothing without darkness.

this

[The Overfiend]

Agents won`t protect you from this, people with agents still don`t get paid.

What will protect you from this is investigation and a bit of Savvy.

Again you miss the point entirely by labeling any discussion, discourse or debate as "Hate".

Nobody is being hated here, it`s just straight talking.
You say techno is like a family?

Well, the one thing you can rely on with famly above all else, above friends, is honesty.
You may be king of the world but your mum can still cut you down to the ground and bring you down to earth with the truth, rather than telling you how great you are all the time.

As adults we should be able to cope with criticism and fair debate, and yes disagreement, in a civilised and adult way.
Anyone who can`t take it or cries and stamps their feet needs to go back to school.

There`s nothing wrong with big ups as well, but when you bleet like a sheep about how great everyone is all the time, it just becomes meaningless noise.
It`s all about contrasts, light means nothing without darkness.

Credit where credit is due, and criticism also.

No one is biggin' up anyone Steve, all you are doing is taking my feedback and manipulating it into a character assasination. You started a thread criticising the "big name" prices. Now all of the sudden it's become the usual let's save techno thread with you on the horse screaming death to all who oppose. I will not let you discredit my stance with blatant insults trying to discredit what I am saying by telling me "I don't understand the point of the thread."

I don't big up anything unless it is impressive to me, I also don't worry about anyone else's finances unless it's f*ckin with my own.

Credit Crunch Vs Arrogance of Big Names
(Why don't you stay on topic then)

[The_Laughing_Man]

No one is biggin' up anyone Steve, all you are doing is taking my feedback and manipulating it into a character assasination. You started a thread criticising the "big name" prices. Now all of the sudden it's become the usual let's save techno thread with you on the horse screaming death to all who oppose. I will not let you discredit my stance with blatant insults trying to discredit what I am saying by telling me "I don't understand the point of the thread."

I don't big up anything unless it is impressive to me, I also don't worry about anyone else's finances unless it's f*ckin with my own.

Credit Crunch Vs Arrogance of Big Names
(Why don't you stay on topic then)

Screw staying on topic, rules are there to be broken and conversations evolve, standpoints even change, as you are allowed to change your mind.

There`s no character assassination here, this isn`t about you.
It`s the colloquiel "you" I am using when I say things such as "There`s nothing wrong with big ups as well, but when you bleet like a sheep about how great everyone is all the time, it just becomes meaningless noise.
It`s all about contrasts, light means nothing without darkness"

You take offence much too quickly.

If you read my first post, it`s quite generic and not really attacking anyone in specific, nor does it point the finger at ALL big names.

Again you miss the point, as this isn`t so much worrying about the wages of the DJ`s, it`s more related to the promoters perspective.
Nor is this about saving techno, it is merely a discussion looking for solutions.
Rather than one word answers.

Looking at the big picture, and everyone involved (taking the soundsystems for example, I know a few sound hire firms going out of business, and also having to drop their fees, do the real hard sweaty work, and possibkly get less money when DJ Diva doesn`t pull in enough of a crowd but demands full fee, for example)

The point I am really trying to make is that the scene is more than the DJ`s.
Especially now, and Diva like behaviour is ugly.

I do worry about some peoples finances. Friends in the biz who have worked really really ****ing hard and are struggling. Not just DJ`s, the other people that also make things happen.
I worry about my friends and I try to help them.
A more considered approach from everyone will allow everyone to be fairly treated and still feed the kids/rent/pets/coke habit etc

Communication is everything, agree or disagree it doesn`t really matter, wrangling, praising, biting etc as long as it is handled with an adult brain and if possible, without ego, then there is no problem.

[Igneous]

Looking at the big picture, and everyone involved (taking the soundsystems for example, I know a few sound hire firms going out of business, and also having to drop their fees, do the real hard sweaty work, and possibkly get less money when DJ Diva doesn`t pull in enough of a crowd but demands full fee, for example)

The point I am really trying to make is that the scene is more than the DJ`s.
Especially now, and Diva like behaviour is ugly.

I do worry about some peoples finances. Friends in the biz who have worked really really ****ing hard and are struggling. Not just DJ`s, the other people that also make things happen.
I worry about my friends and I try to help them.
A more considered approach from everyone will allow everyone to be fairly treated and still feed the kids/rent/pets/coke habit etc

Communication is everything, agree or disagree it doesn`t really matter, wrangling, praising, biting etc as long as it is handled with an adult brain and if possible, without ego, then there is no problem.

I hear what your saying to an extent. DJs are treated like pop stars these days. Techno isn't as bad as a lot of genres, but its worse than it used to be cause DJs rely on the money to pay morgauges etc, even underground scenes have had to become commercialised. Product of sucess.

Trouble is, when you look at life in general, with the old credit crunch & greedy banks, etc, nothing is fair on people who work really hard. Seems even techno is capitalist, lol. The dance music industy isn't very regulated so there isn't any guarenties of being paid. You could try & introduce a minimum & maximum wage based on skill for DJs but it would probley stiffle creativity & the DJs would be able to play the system one way or the other. So back to square 1.

I Quite like going to the odd free party now & again, where everything is put together without much money & it doesn't matter what DJs are playing for a change of vibe.

For the record, I think new nights shouldn't bother with big names. Just book locals & up & comings. The nights that last will have push these names forward to be big names. If that happens enough 'The scene' should continue on as normal.